XP changes need to be rolled back, it was well intentioned but having poor outcomes

Started 10 Nov 2019
by shratness
in Tavern
If the intention of the XP changes were to make levelling easier it's had the exact opposite effect across the entire spectrum. If the desire was to make levelling harder a lot of us don't really understand the point on a freeshard where the population needs to be boosted and making the "grind" to 50 harder has the opposite effect.

1. Groups don't seem to have been affected by the social changes, the bonus needs to be on top of all other bonuses not the base XP if you want people to start to invite non desirable classes and likely needs to be higher. As it stands it's still more beneficial to have another caster/healer in a PBAOE group to chew through mobs faster than it is to invite a warden or nightshade to the group.

2. The task collection items still suck. It still takes roughly 3-4 stacks of 10 items to get the same XP 10 items was giving you before. Given the drop rate is reduced it's nearly pointless to even bother with these tasks anymore. Last week I grouped with 4 others to do task collection quests and we managed to move along from task to task as we levelled and we all managed to turn in 10 at a time before moving to the next type of item. If you want to do collection tasks now it actually discourages grouping because the drop rates are lower and the xp for turn in worse.

3. The daily mob type bonuses just add rng to when to level and make levelling slower. At 200% bonuses for certain. mob types it's pointless to level alts when the popular camps are not on bonus day as you're literally just wasting time.

To top it off a lot of these changes seemed intended to make social levelling more attractive (invite any classes and go grind mobs yay!) but they actually just reinforce the need for a major PBAOE group as you now get no benefit to grouping for collection tasks and need to burn through more mobs as fast as possible to get the same XP/hr as before.

Can we please get these changes reverted? It was near perfect for group/solo/alts and new players alike and this has just made it significantly worse all around.
Sun 10 Nov 2019 12:47 AM by Fenork
Totally agree, i hope they read this..
Sun 10 Nov 2019 3:53 AM by ExcretusMaximus
For all you know, it's having the exact intended result.
Sun 10 Nov 2019 5:18 AM by shratness
ExcretusMaximus wrote:
Sun 10 Nov 2019 3:53 AM
For all you know, it's having the exact intended result.

Sure, they didn't state their intentions other than it was obvious they wanted to try and make it so people moved around a little bit more and they also wanted to make it so less desirable classes for PvE got into groups (Stealthers, melee's etc…)

Fact is it's way way way worse to level a non-desirable class now as solo/duo/trio farming task items is totally ruined and groups still don't want you because the bonus xp for different classes is just not worth it.

If their intention was to slow down levelling and make it more painful and reduce server population than bravo they are doing a fantastic job.
Sun 10 Nov 2019 3:31 PM by gotwqqd
shratness wrote:
Sun 10 Nov 2019 5:18 AM
ExcretusMaximus wrote:
Sun 10 Nov 2019 3:53 AM
For all you know, it's having the exact intended result.

Sure, they didn't state their intentions other than it was obvious they wanted to try and make it so people moved around a little bit more and they also wanted to make it so less desirable classes for PvE got into groups (Stealthers, melee's etc…)

Fact is it's way way way worse to level a non-desirable class now as solo/duo/trio farming task items is totally ruined and groups still don't want you because the bonus xp for different classes is just not worth it.

If their intention was to slow down levelling and make it more painful and reduce server population than bravo they are doing a fantastic job.
So is the choice between uthgard and Phoenix harder?
Sun 10 Nov 2019 6:21 PM by Torye
I've asked this question and received a private answer that it was to make it so that people couldn't hit fifty within 24 hours played (why this would be an issue i don't know) and that it would make grouping stealthers and other non grouped characters more desirable. I actually started leveling my hunter up again and it's been a horrible ordeal. I am not a noob to leveling since i also have a level 50 templated shadowblade, two sm's (were the easiest to level) skald, templated shaman and a bone dancer. The leveling of this hunter is painful. The others were just fine. I am not sure who they thought were abusing the leveling or whatever but this change is just horrible.
Sun 10 Nov 2019 6:28 PM by Hubert124567
Yeah.... make it hard for the newbies.... loel. Sounds like fun the already rr11 players can do 1v1 in Beno or Crauch with 20 players Primetime.

I think hittin 50 in 12 Hours is the way to go !
Mon 11 Nov 2019 12:34 PM by Wasted_Content
shratness wrote:
Sun 10 Nov 2019 12:43 AM
(Everything he said in the OG post)

Agreed.

I would like to say I like the idea of having a task reward token you can share with your other toons, but the reality of the XP changes nerfing xp/hr so hard is a huge feelsbadman.
Mon 11 Nov 2019 7:01 PM by stewbeedoo
Yeah the XP changes are only benefiting the farmers who are selling xp items as fast as they can put them on their merchants.

Please revert this. It makes no sense to make it harder to get to 50 - it was fine the way it was.
Mon 11 Nov 2019 7:15 PM by Cymosxl
Rollback fast,this will kill the server,many people come back in winter,with this painfully leveling they won't stay
Mon 11 Nov 2019 7:49 PM by Hubert124567
looks strange to me that buying xp items in Hz is the way they wanted it..... nerf beach but now you can buy them in HZ . idk yeah new players cant do that but the old elite can buy all they want.... well as intended. would be nice to get the intention , i dont get it hehe .
Mon 11 Nov 2019 7:55 PM by Cinthel
We went out farming grovewoods in cliffs of moher with 2 anis and a bard. 30 mins farming 5 grovewood barks total. we killed every grovewood tree there was. The droprate needs to be higher than that. What is the point in removing the 10/10 restriction when the droprate is minimal? This needs to be rolled back or reworked. Please put it to a vote.
Tue 12 Nov 2019 7:13 PM by Clockwork
Torye wrote:
Sun 10 Nov 2019 6:21 PM
I've asked this question and received a private answer that it was to make it so that people couldn't hit fifty within 24 hours played...

This sounds like someone misquoted us, it has -always- been the goal that the casual average player -can- (on average) hit 1-50 in /played of 24hrs. Which is why when we rolled this out and people were complaining I asked that people show that they're taking -longer- than /played 24hrs and truly are getting slower leveling times.

So just taking a moment to correct that rumor.
Tue 12 Nov 2019 9:25 PM by Wolfir666
Cinthel wrote:
Mon 11 Nov 2019 7:55 PM
We went out farming grovewoods in cliffs of moher with 2 anis and a bard. 30 mins farming 5 grovewood barks total. we killed every grovewood tree there was. The droprate needs to be higher than that. What is the point in removing the 10/10 restriction when the droprate is minimal? This needs to be rolled back or reworked. Please put it to a vote.

so true so true..
Was writing that days ago already at another location.
It just makes no sense, if the intention was really to make leveling faster.

To be honest, it just leaves the impression, that it's supposed to make leveling faster for those, that spent loads of plats for buying farmed stuff from others, rather than leveling by themselves.
Thu 14 Nov 2019 1:09 AM by Wasted_Content
Wolfir666 wrote:
Tue 12 Nov 2019 9:25 PM
To be honest, it just leaves the impression, that it's supposed to make leveling faster for those, that spent loads of plats for buying farmed stuff from others, rather than leveling by themselves.


Exactly.

Levelling in a group now is abysmal. Have to pull less mobs because of the mob damage increase and then get a huge reduction in XP through mob type bonus and reduced task rewards. It is REALLY frustrating to play with.
Fri 22 Nov 2019 3:59 PM by falcon
Wolfir666 wrote:
Tue 12 Nov 2019 9:25 PM
To be honest, it just leaves the impression, that it's supposed to make leveling faster for those, that spent loads of plats for buying farmed stuff from others, rather than leveling by themselves.

Right ! XP now much faster, and not only for rich, don't tell me u are unable to have a farm toon level 19 ? drop rate for xp item is often about 20%, you can earn one free level for your toon every 15mn, if u prefer buy them for a price too high its your problem ^^
I bought 100 xp item level 20 4P for my toon in marketplace, and just noticed I need only 1h to drop them, just lazy like too much people here :p
Fri 22 Nov 2019 5:19 PM by Torye
Falcon you always take a dig at people that don't like the new leveling system by saying they are either whining (really just stating their concerns) or that they suck at daoc (no we just don't see the need for the change) As i mentioned in other threads, it's great you are making oodles of money and gathering the shiny objects but seriously, that's not what these threads are about . They are about people seeing how a change has adversely affected the gaming experience of others, and not just others as in "me , myself and I. they are thinking of new players and experienced players that are becoming frustrated with the leveling pain. And we are comparing it to what used to be here on phoenix, we really don't care about other servers. This used to be a well balanced system and now it really isn't fun. So again, kudos to your ability to gather wealth and shiny objects, great you can make multiple leveling noobies to put things on the marketplace and gouge the crap out of your fellow players, but please keep in mind most people are trying to complete a toon and outfit it for rvr. They are interested in money and shiny stuff, but not to the great extent that you are.
Fri 22 Nov 2019 9:11 PM by Gfxygames
Am I the only one who doesn't think this xp change wasn't that bad? I agree it made it more grindy and benefits farmers. But, I am still chugging along just fine solo leveling my NS. Almost level 47.
Fri 22 Nov 2019 9:25 PM by shintacki
Relative to other servers or true classic XP rates, no it isn't that bad. But solo leveling is definitely slower than it was before. Most people just don't get why they made these changes cause no one had an issue with XP before.
Fri 22 Nov 2019 9:35 PM by Wolfir666
shintacki wrote:
Fri 22 Nov 2019 9:25 PM
Relative to other servers or true classic XP rates, no it isn't that bad. But solo leveling is definitely slower than it was before. Most people just don't get why they made these changes cause no one had an issue with XP before.

Exactly that.
It just makes no sense.
It makes no sense, to make solo-leveling slower, when the whole sense of the game is RvR on 50.
It makes no sense, to lift the turn-in-limit of XP-items, and at the same time lowering the drop-rate of them.
It makes no sense, to lower the XP you get in RvR-tasks with XPers dieing to enemies or suiciding at keeps/towers, but not lowering the RP at the same time.

Each time you think of it again, each time you rephrase it in your mind again, it all comes to the same conclusion:
Yay 50.
Yay RP.
Yay Farmers.
Boo Leveling towards 50.

And that's simply strange, as the message it sends, to new players, to starters, to those being interested in trying out the best MMORPG of all times (saw that lately on a website as voting result), is "get lost!".
Sat 23 Nov 2019 1:58 PM by falcon
Wolfir666 wrote:
Fri 22 Nov 2019 9:35 PM
It makes no sense, to make solo-leveling slower, when the whole sense of the game is RvR on 50.
It makes no sense, to lift the turn-in-limit of XP-items, and at the same time lowering the drop-rate of them.
It makes no sense, to lower the XP you get in RvR-tasks with XPers dieing to enemies or suiciding at keeps/towers, but not lowering the RP at the same time.

I always up my char solo, the difference is before I need several months and now several hours (I have screen if u want and I used only 2 or 3 xp items x60 bought or drop), why u share this fake news xp now slower ?

If drop rate was the same, is giving an instant 50 to anyone with 2P in bank (now need 5-10P its too cheap & too fast yet, my opinion...) you see how people cry before they can't find group (half people doen't xp anymore, up is so fast now...) imagine if /instant 50 was implanted...

XP after 35 in RVR is just incredible, not a day when I didn't up 2 times (so many task, bonus, token, kill...) 1st time I need to /xp off to not up 50 in less 1 week (I want to kill few more dunters before grey :p)
Sat 23 Nov 2019 4:43 PM by Torye
Falcon in not sure why you think xp is faster. It's slower, it's like you are one of the server managers being incognito trying to say this over and over again so the rest of us that play on your server believe you. It's slower than what it used to be on this sever, and the rest of us don't understand why they would change that part of the process since no one was bitching about it.
Sat 23 Nov 2019 4:55 PM by Valaraukar
I don't like these changes too, they are too friendly to the ones who can farm for hours and who already have lots of money to spend. It is not friendly at all to new gamers or to "normal" casual gamers that do not have 6 hours per day to spend farming to get tokens and xp items for their other toons.
Why they did so? ...well this is a good question, and I still haven't read any serious answer from the staff. It is too vague, I believe that they have a goal but really I could not understand what it is and then why this change has been applied to XP.
Sat 23 Nov 2019 5:55 PM by Sepplord
With the recent changes to social XP Boni grouping seems to be not that bad anymore, probably similar or even better than before (depending on setup)
Sat 23 Nov 2019 7:50 PM by gotwqqd
falcon wrote:
Sat 23 Nov 2019 1:58 PM
Wolfir666 wrote:
Fri 22 Nov 2019 9:35 PM
It makes no sense, to make solo-leveling slower, when the whole sense of the game is RvR on 50.
It makes no sense, to lift the turn-in-limit of XP-items, and at the same time lowering the drop-rate of them.
It makes no sense, to lower the XP you get in RvR-tasks with XPers dieing to enemies or suiciding at keeps/towers, but not lowering the RP at the same time.

I always up my char solo, the difference is before I need several months and now several hours (I have screen if u want and I used only 2 or 3 xp items x60 bought or drop), why u share this fake news xp now slower ?

If drop rate was the same, is giving an instant 50 to anyone with 2P in bank (now need 5-10P its too cheap & too fast yet, my opinion...) you see how people cry before they can't find group (half people doen't xp anymore, up is so fast now...) imagine if /instant 50 was implanted...

XP after 35 in RVR is just incredible, not a day when I didn't up 2 times (so many task, bonus, token, kill...) 1st time I need to /xp off to not up 50 in less 1 week (I want to kill few more dunters before grey :p)
Months? I leveled 20+ to 50 and none of them took more than 24 hrs
Mostly soloing
Sat 23 Nov 2019 8:15 PM by Wolfir666
Just like with the guy who invented the saying "fake news" I don't even bother to read what that falcon writes to be honest. Just not worth to comment on.
Of course it never were months on phoenix. Probably he stumbled over his own fake news.

Edit.
Good thing he is on alb.
To be honest i think it's his way of causing people to give up on posting what they don't like about the change.
As he was in all the threads writing down the same stuff about him buying and farming and paying and never understanding that most xpers don't want to pay 5p for level 30 to 35 like he did. Yes falcon, I still laugh when thinking of what you wrote there in one of your first posts. 5p for 5 levels. Yay. I still think beach must have been cheaper than that on alb before the change.
Sat 23 Nov 2019 8:39 PM by gotwqqd
Wolfir666 wrote:
Sat 23 Nov 2019 8:15 PM
Just like with the guy who invented the saying "fake news" I don't even bother to read what that falcon writes to be honest. Just not worth to comment on.
Of course it never were months on phoenix. Probably he stumbled over his own fake news.

Edit.
Good thing he is on alb.
To be honest i think it's his way of causing people to give up on posting what they don't like about the change.
As he was in all the threads writing down the same stuff about him buying and farming and paying and never understanding that most xpers don't want to pay 5p for level 30 to 35 like he did. Yes falcon, I still laugh when thinking of what you wrote there in one of your first posts. 5p for 5 levels. Yay. I still think beach must have been cheaper than that on alb before the change.
I think he is just advertising that items are the way to xp fast so he sells more
Sat 23 Nov 2019 9:22 PM by falcon
gotwqqd wrote:
Sat 23 Nov 2019 7:50 PM
Months? I leveled 20+ to 50 and none of them took more than 24 hrs
Mostly soloing

Of course my main cabal finished in 1 week (next one 1 day now I never talk about /played just /4 if u prefer /played) but I had about 10 levels 30 (not farmer) in stand by blocked in their XP (old method was very slow ^^) they are all 40+ today and in rvr

gotwqqd wrote:
Sat 23 Nov 2019 8:39 PM
I think he is just advertising that items are the way to xp fast so he sells more

I have 0 in bank and no more items to sell, nobody understand now each gold = % of level
Each time I have 20 xp items or 500gold = 1 level for my toons need 10-15mn (but I have many toons :p)

My only target is to have fun with this game not become the richiest ^^ until last week levels 1-25 was always fun & fast and 25-35 slow and boring especially without AOE (after 35 too fast no change :p ) today u can skip this nightmare from 25-35 now your farm class works for 100% of your levels (66% before)
Play how u like, even in group if u prefer, but please don't say xp is now slower than before its just wrong... (surprised sometimes 10xp item enough to up when 0 bubble so test before crying and don't trust people who say we now need 50 xp items to up (and need 10 hours to drop them...), NO sometimes 10, sometimes 15 and never more 30 if near your level ^^) = 15mn (10 with money+loot to buy more ^^)
(and price x5 1st week now only x2 second week on alb we found now often 10 xp item for 200g ^^ too cheap for my tastes, /level 50 cost now less 10P

(when I see the price u spend for armor 100% with abla , I think 10P for a level 50 done in few hours and well equiped (u drop 1-2 rog 60U a day for him farming xp items...) is not so expensive...)
Sun 24 Nov 2019 12:23 AM by lolhisup
I am not a fan of the changes to leveling.

I don't like how xp bonus on mobs changes every day.

I had a groove going for leveling alts. There was a fairly easy and set path to leveling. Xp bonus wasn't changed every day so you knew that on any given day you could take the same leveling path and level quickly.

I have a Friar and a Theurgist at level 26, and it is abysmally slow to level. Around this time normally what I would do is just pick a mob to get xp items from, get 10, turn in Phoenix Eggs, turn in Soils, and grind on high bonus xp mobs (in Albion was like Insect, Dragon, etc...). It was just easy and quick. Once you get to 35, every 30 minutes run out and suicide on an enemy keep so you get the participation reward. Just do that in addition to what you were doing before, and very easily, consistently, you could knock out 2-4 levels per day no issues.

But now, I log in and I have to check what the bonus is. Xp items practically seem like a waste of time to farm now. Sometimes I don't know where to go for the right mobs. I mostly just try to ride the tasks but it is just soooo slow and boring. Unless things get changed I am not sure I will ever get these characters to 50, because grinding slow slow xp on mobs all day is just not going to happen for me. I play this game so I can fight other players not do the same thing over and over and over against the same mob over and over and over.

I say I am lfg in the /lfg channel, and even as a friar, I don't even get people to invite me. I think everyone just wants to do all the "perfect" fancy people groups all the time. They would prefer a cleric for the buffs I assume.

Basically, this is like Uthgard leveling status at this point for me.
Sun 24 Nov 2019 1:46 AM by ColdHands
I had no issues leveling a sorc after these changes. 2 of my friend leveled new characters too in the same time frame.
This was my first character in this realm and I dont know my way around. If it was a realm i was established in i imagine it would take 15-20 hrs tops for basically any class.
1-50 just just over 24 hours played. I was about 50% solo and farming xp items and high bonus mobs until 40 then had a couple decent DF and POC groups.
Not painful at all, even the soloing part.
Sun 24 Nov 2019 4:38 PM by falcon
lolhisup wrote:
Sun 24 Nov 2019 12:23 AM
...
I have a Friar and a Theurgist at level 26, and it is abysmally slow to level. ... I play this game so I can fight other players not do the same thing over and over and over against the same mob over and over and over.


You entered in nightmare mode level 25-35 are the worst of the game, thats why Dev removed these levels and replaced by 100 grim drop + 100 dunter drops
Now if u cant buy theses item or unable to drop them (I have a doubt with theur, 1 pet on each green grim I'm sure not much more slower than cabal, maybe need 2mn / drop just drop 50 and buy 50 others with loot & money earn price is now 20-30g each) please don't blame DEV, its just a free bonus they gave with token+unlimited xp item, if u don't like xp item, skip them and xp will be as slow as before, no more no less ^^ (a little bit faster with few free bubles given every day with token)

(and once again when u are 35 your xp finished and u can have fun in RVR (its often more easy to group at 35 than 50, many low level group formed), yes I know its incredible, but just up 35 and follow zerg you will understand :p Need to up a 40 Wiz again because dunter was grey and 1st wizard started last week is 48 4L2 (without xp item since 40) I forgot to /xp off 24h and too late

And if u think u need to be 50 in rvr with 100% armor to have fun, u are wrong (did 52k yesterday :p)
Sun 1 Dec 2019 11:01 PM by pollojack
falcon wrote:
Sun 24 Nov 2019 4:38 PM
lolhisup wrote:
Sun 24 Nov 2019 12:23 AM
...
I have a Friar and a Theurgist at level 26, and it is abysmally slow to level. ... I play this game so I can fight other players not do the same thing over and over and over against the same mob over and over and over.


You entered in nightmare mode level 25-35 are the worst of the game, thats why Dev removed these levels and replaced by 100 grim drop + 100 dunter drops
Now if u cant buy theses item or unable to drop them (I have a doubt with theur, 1 pet on each green grim I'm sure not much more slower than cabal, maybe need 2mn / drop just drop 50 and buy 50 others with loot & money earn price is now 20-30g each) please don't blame DEV, its just a free bonus they gave with token+unlimited xp item, if u don't like xp item, skip them and xp will be as slow as before, no more no less ^^ (a little bit faster with few free bubles given every day with token)

(and once again when u are 35 your xp finished and u can have fun in RVR (its often more easy to group at 35 than 50, many low level group formed), yes I know its incredible, but just up 35 and follow zerg you will understand :p Need to up a 40 Wiz again because dunter was grey and 1st wizard started last week is 48 4L2 (without xp item since 40) I forgot to /xp off 24h and too late

And if u think u need to be 50 in rvr with 100% armor to have fun, u are wrong (did 52k yesterday :p)

Admins disabled low lvls task credit for a reason. This contradicts that design decision but perhaps I am one of the few that don't care for fights where the opponent has no chance of winning.
Sun 1 Dec 2019 11:35 PM by falcon
pollojack wrote:
Sun 1 Dec 2019 11:01 PM
Admins disabled low lvls task credit for a reason. ...

In fact, its a rollback , we are back in this paradise where we can up from level 1 to 50, just need to be killed by a guard to have 1 or 2 free bubbles <3

The only difference is now, another higher char your own need to do that (and give u the token)

(of course this method little bit slow, but nothing fastest than few tokens & XP item given by another char everyday, YOU decide if this free XP will be 10% 50% or 100% of your final char ^^)

But from beginning of the game, I'm sure u know you need 2 chars in this game , 1 to help the other (equip...)
Only people pigheaded who wants only 1 have difficulties (not DEV or Mark Jacobs Fault it was always like this from beginning, no change ^^)
Mon 2 Dec 2019 12:52 AM by gotwqqd
falcon wrote:
Sun 1 Dec 2019 11:35 PM
pollojack wrote:
Sun 1 Dec 2019 11:01 PM
Admins disabled low lvls task credit for a reason. ...

In fact, its a rollback , we are back in this paradise where we can up from level 1 to 50, just need to be killed by a guard to have 1 or 2 free bubbles <3

The only difference is now, another higher char your own need to do that (and give u the token)

(of course this method little bit slow, but nothing fastest than few tokens & XP item given by another char everyday, YOU decide if this free XP will be 10% 50% or 100% of your final char ^^)

But from beginning of the game, I'm sure u know you need 2 chars in this game , 1 to help the other (equip...)
Only people pigheaded who wants only 1 have difficulties (not DEV or Mark Jacobs Fault it was always like this from beginning, no change ^^)
Not many care about the xp...they would like the rp’s
Mon 2 Dec 2019 8:51 AM by falcon
gotwqqd wrote:
Mon 2 Dec 2019 12:52 AM
Not many care about the xp...they would like the rp’s

They have after 35 (few hours XP now, few mn if u have enough P, easy with epic DJ all the week ^^)
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