Are these new changes a nerf to gold/xp for task completion and XP item turn ins?

Started 8 Nov 2019
by Wasted_Content
in Tavern
Maybe I'm misunderstanding. Can someone clarify some points for me?

completing a task will result in receiving a new item that can be traded as well as turned in at your trainer, turning in these items represents another task

so I kill 15/15 demons and instead of a reward I get an item to turn in to the trainer? Or both?

Completing this new turn in task will itself not provide a task completion token

Turning in the token won't give you a token? Is that what this sentence means?

the xp reward for task completions (kill x animals etc., rvr tasks) will be changed to your level * the xp you would receive for a mob of your level, this is an increase up to level 19 and an increasing reductionso a big nerf from there on, at level 49 this would be a reduction to 25% of the current value(?!).

Increase to XP up to 19 (already super fast and easy, so fast in fact that xp items are pointless) Decrease to XP at higher levels (Why make PvE harder?)

Please note that collection task item turn in is tied to the same reward system but instead of using your current level these turn ins will always use the minimum level of the item.

The minimum level of the "token" you receive? What level is the token? Is it your level when you complete the task?


Body Type XP Rework
Initially the plan / hope was to have a dynamic system that encourages people to seek out new spots and at the beginning it certainly worked well, however, due to how the dynamic bonus is determined there isn't really ever a change. To get back to the original intention we're changing it to be determined daily (will survive restarts as it will depend on the date), one body type will receive 25% bonus another 50%, another 75% and finally another 100%.

So first I did a bunch of work cataloging XP spots for OF, then I had to re-do all my spots when you swapped to NF, and now you're telling me that the XP type mob is going to cycle daily? This game is *not* getting more new-player friendly, I can tell you that.

7) Dense spawn areas will see some of their mobs receive spells that should not affect normal group play much, this only applies to classic and si zones
Example spells: a low damage instant cast snare nuke with a 10 second cool down
This will only affect the beach in albion and the red caps in moderna in midgard for now, more spots may or may not be changed or this might be rolled back depending on what happens in game.

Straight nerfing farm classes. Mid and Alb hit hard. Is this to discourage people farming plat in a game where you literally need to farm plat to afford gear to template and be relevant?


Some interesting changes coming but nothing making the server more accessible to new players. Taking some massive dumps on a lot of peoples hard work (salvaging on multiple characters, cataloging XP items, levelling up farm classes). I hope Phoenix has something in the pipes for people who need Raid credit, new players who are trying to join DAoC, and PvPers who don't like NF zerg surfing. Time will tell.
Fri 8 Nov 2019 7:46 AM by Sepplord
the goal of the bonuses is to have variety in spots...not people making a spot-catalogue and running to the same spot over and over again
the also removed the cap on collection item turn ins (these turn in items have a levelrange, which will now always take the minimum level...weird that you are so settled and don't know about this)
Being able to do as many turn ins as you want is HUGE and will be a big boost to levelling speeds



nerfing of ultrafarmclasses is not neccessarily a bad thing, it means that everyone who doesn't solo-farm like that is better of in comparision. Especially new players might not need an extra farmclass and playtime off-hours to get one of the ultra-farmspots
Fri 8 Nov 2019 9:08 AM by Lipsi
Wasted_Content wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 1:50 AM
Straight nerfing farm classes. Mid and Alb hit hard. Is this to discourage people farming plat in a game where you literally need to farm plat to afford gear to template and be relevant?

I think it is to discourage solo bad behaviours and promote group play.

Before moving to Hib, i went once in Moderna as a solo savage for leveling - out of curiosity and new to server -. When i arrived at redcap camp it was literraly empty of mobs. 1 shaman running circles around spot and 1 level 10- afk PL toon a bit further.

I tried to catch 1 redcap on respawn, received instantly a pm that this was not allowed to pull mobs in a spot already taken, that i was a noob and such a loser. I do not feel so special to presume that i am the only player to whom that story happened.

May be in the end the 2 zones became controversial and not so fun with both the farmers and non farmers reporting abuses / code of conduct, besides some several hot topics on the forum about aoe farming, decided the staff to do something about it.
Fri 8 Nov 2019 2:45 PM by Expfighter
Lipsi wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 9:08 AM
Wasted_Content wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 1:50 AM
Straight nerfing farm classes. Mid and Alb hit hard. Is this to discourage people farming plat in a game where you literally need to farm plat to afford gear to template and be relevant?

I think it is to discourage solo bad behaviours and promote group play.

Before moving to Hib, i went once in Moderna as a solo savage for leveling - out of curiosity and new to server -. When i arrived at redcap camp it was literraly empty of mobs. 1 shaman running circles around spot and 1 level 10- afk PL toon a bit further.

I tried to catch 1 redcap on respawn, received instantly a pm that this was not allowed to pull mobs in a spot already taken, that i was a noob and such a loser. I do not feel so special to presume that i am the only player to whom that story happened.

May be in the end the 2 zones became controversial and not so fun with both the farmers and non farmers reporting abuses / code of conduct, besides some several hot topics on the forum about aoe farming, decided the staff to do something about it.

actually whoever told you that you cant pull from a camp already taken was WRONG, there is no camp rules here.

If there is a mob and you hit it first it is yours, period! if you hit someone else's mob and keep doing it, that is wrong
Fri 8 Nov 2019 3:11 PM by gotwqqd
Sepplord wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 7:46 AM
the goal of the bonuses is to have variety in spots...not people making a spot-catalogue and running to the same spot over and over again
the also removed the cap on collection item turn ins (these turn in items have a levelrange, which will now always take the minimum level...weird that you are so settled and don't know about this)
Being able to do as many turn ins as you want is HUGE and will be a big boost to levelling speeds



nerfing of ultrafarmclasses is not neccessarily a bad thing, it means that everyone who doesn't solo-farm like that is better of in comparision. Especially new players might not need an extra farmclass and playtime off-hours to get one of the ultra-farmspots
While it sounds like a good idea I don’t think it’s so great.
I was xping solo in alb frontiers yesterday trying to find all the different mob types . There is simply too much land void of mobs to have to search for a particular mob type.

I was still moving around, why is this needed?
Fri 8 Nov 2019 6:50 PM by kratoxin
Lipsi wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 9:08 AM
Wasted_Content wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 1:50 AM
Straight nerfing farm classes. Mid and Alb hit hard. Is this to discourage people farming plat in a game where you literally need to farm plat to afford gear to template and be relevant?

I think it is to discourage solo bad behaviours and promote group play.

Before moving to Hib, i went once in Moderna as a solo savage for leveling - out of curiosity and new to server -. When i arrived at redcap camp it was literraly empty of mobs. 1 shaman running circles around spot and 1 level 10- afk PL toon a bit further.

I tried to catch 1 redcap on respawn, received instantly a pm that this was not allowed to pull mobs in a spot already taken, that i was a noob and such a loser. I do not feel so special to presume that i am the only player to whom that story happened.

May be in the end the 2 zones became controversial and not so fun with both the farmers and non farmers reporting abuses / code of conduct, besides some several hot topics on the forum about aoe farming, decided the staff to do something about it.
actually isn't this just like an animist camping 1 WHOLE camp being ---> grieving of other players from sharing the camp pool?
Fri 8 Nov 2019 7:46 PM by Lipsi
kratoxin wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 6:50 PM
actually isn't this just like an animist camping 1 WHOLE camp being ---> grieving of other players from sharing the camp pool?

My experience in Hibernia has been quite different, the animists i met camping a whole camp more often than not offered to join group to get PL and a share of the coins and loots But this i guess is a bit off topic.
Also, i am not aware of good farming spots in Hibernia, and animists (and Mana Mentalists who share the same tactics as shamans for kiting spots solo) that i know who are farming, usually go out in the frontier zone, at the Fins south of Dun Bolg, taking the risk of getting ambushed by ennemy players.
Sat 9 Nov 2019 6:31 AM by Topenga
Sepplord wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 7:46 AM
Being able to do as many turn ins as you want is HUGE and will be a big boost to levelling speeds

Wrong! Quite the opposite as xp loot and task xp is worth crap now!

loot xp turn on lvl49:
it was 4 bubbs before, it is now 1,1 bubbs, so roughly 25%
task xp was 0,5 bubbs before, it is now 0,15, so roughly 33%

I dont see the point in this!
Sat 9 Nov 2019 10:35 AM by Ele
With the fast rollout of a second patch that increases the amount of xp after decreasing it, my guess is there was either a mistake in the code or they simply miscalculated the xp gain via tasks/xp items. With the fact that a bug that prevented fg's from getting task credit got fixed I lean towards the first guess.
Reminds me of a phrase from the old days: never play on patch day...
Sat 9 Nov 2019 4:27 PM by Torye
Has it been fixed then? I was leveling in mid yesterday and the xp was painfully slow. With few players starting new characters this seems to be counter productive.
Sat 9 Nov 2019 8:04 PM by Amorphium
Haven't played for a while, wanted to get back in but it seems Phoenix has done an Uthgard...
Please, someone tell me it isn't so.
Mon 11 Nov 2019 12:30 PM by Wasted_Content
Sepplord wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 7:46 AM
the goal of the bonuses is to have variety in spots...not people making a spot-catalogue and running to the same spot over and over again

Yeah I get that, but WHY? Why punish players who took the time to find spots and catalogue them. Makes no sense to shit on someone's hard work. Phoenix now forces people to put up with a rotating schedule of mobs all over the freakin world to acquire their XP bonus. I do not think this is a good idea.

Sepplord wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 7:46 AM
the also removed the cap on collection item turn ins (these turn in items have a levelrange, which will now always take the minimum level...weird that you are so settled and don't know about this)

I didn't bring this up in my post and I'm not sure why you took the time to bring it up and then be condescending towards me after making a point I....whatever. --> I saw they did it and they nerfed the XP you get per turn in (It was ~9 bubbs from 20-30, in case you didn't know, but you're incredibly condescending so im sure you already knew) and now it is MUCH, MUCH less. Which makes your next sentence...

Sepplord wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 7:46 AM
Being able to do as many turn ins as you want is HUGE and will be a big boost to levelling speeds

WRONG. They also nerfed xp item drop rates. So, double nerf.

Sepplord wrote:
Fri 8 Nov 2019 7:46 AM
nerfing of ultrafarmclasses is not neccessarily a bad thing, it means that everyone who doesn't solo-farm like that is better of in comparision. Especially new players might not need an extra farmclass and playtime off-hours to get one of the ultra-farmspots

On this we actually agree. Mostly. I understand nerfing the ultra farmers (mod and beach) but I'm curious to see how far they're gonna go. Also every new player who asks how to farm gold is told, generally, "roll a farm class". And when new players are asking me for advice, I tell them they should roll a farm class first so they can finance their other toons. It's...the most efficient way to do things. Especially now that raids are few-and-far-between.

Anyway I missed out on this weekend and I see they've changed a few things so I'll be interested to see how this continues to play out.
Fri 15 Nov 2019 6:03 PM by ld420
The XP item drop rate needs a bump up. We are being punished, it feels like, due to the AOE classes being able to murder droves of xp item drop mobs. My friar tried to self farm some xp drops post lvl 30, I ended up hitting 31 grinding the yellow mobs, and only looted 4 of the XP items. So this has driven the price of the items up in market, and the AOE farmers STILL make out like bandits, and the already rich folks can still buy them if they choose, but newer players like me (I dont even have a 50 yet on Alb) cant even the playing field and buy the items, and we cant even efficiently farm the items now. I dont understand why the devs havent looked into this.
Tue 19 Nov 2019 11:12 AM by falcon
ld420 wrote:
Fri 15 Nov 2019 6:03 PM
The XP item drop rate needs a bump up. We are being punished, it feels like, due to the AOE classes being able to murder droves of xp item drop mobs. My friar tried to self farm some xp drops post lvl 30, I ended up hitting 31 grinding the yellow mobs, and only looted 4 of the XP items. So this has driven the price of the items up in market, and the AOE farmers STILL make out like bandits, and the already rich folks can still buy them if they choose, but newer players like me (I dont even have a 50 yet on Alb) cant even the playing field and buy the items, and we cant even efficiently farm the items now. I dont understand why the devs havent looked into this.

You are right about AOE this patch x2 our income about 7P/H (I did calcul on another post) is not a problem for us if 1/10 or 1/20 mob drop (we pull about 15 at time ^^ so about 1 xp item a pull)
It's crazy now to try to drop xp item killing mob 1 by 1, you are level 31 your xp is finished in 4 levels, I'm sure you are able to find 4P in few days (friars are good at DF for seals, don't take my job I will not take yours :p ) then you could buy the 120 dunters head's u need, and once 35, u don't need to kill a mob anymore as everybody know ^^
.
New system is a big up for farmer (never did the beach I prefer xp item so no regret ^^) and for people who prefer up fast to have fun in rvr (just need to find few P to up 20-35, 2 sidi enough if you dont want to create a farmer toon...) so I don't understand why people unhappy ??? farmers have a big smile, people who prefer RVR than killing stupid mob have a big smile now all their small toons 30+ are 40+ and in RVR... I search but I don't see people with reason to cry... maybe people who play just for social and dont have friends irl so they regret to cant spend anymore 12h with 7 others people chatting and up once a day ? or people who like to kill mob 1 by 1 and dont want to go in rvr or killing them 10 by 10 ? strange...
Tue 19 Nov 2019 3:57 PM by Torye
Falcon your post are interesting but pretty much focus on how much of a boon this new leveling system is to someone that wants to make money and keeps dismissing the fact that it was much more "balanced" between making money and leveling before on the old system. While I think it's great that your dreams of getting shiny objects and oodles of money are being fulfilled, it doesn't change the fact that we used to be able to level up in 24 ish hours played and now that time has been doubled. Denigrating others for pointing out the fact that this change was nether asked for nor is it understandable as to why leveling up was made harder is just counter productive on this post. People are asking questions, they aren't whining. And most of us are very proud of you for all the shiny objects you are getting and all the money, but that wasn't our biggest concern. You keep getting really excited about the money part, but don't acknowledge the fact that the xp part is not as "enjoyable" as it used to be but is more of a chore, and was changed really for no reason.
Wed 20 Nov 2019 2:57 AM by gotwqqd
Torye wrote:
Tue 19 Nov 2019 3:57 PM
Falcon your post are interesting but pretty much focus on how much of a boon this new leveling system is to someone that wants to make money and keeps dismissing the fact that it was much more "balanced" between making money and leveling before on the old system. While I think it's great that your dreams of getting shiny objects and oodles of money are being fulfilled, it doesn't change the fact that we used to be able to level up in 24 ish hours played and now that time has been doubled. Denigrating others for pointing out the fact that this change was nether asked for nor is it understandable as to why leveling up was made harder is just counter productive on this post. People are asking questions, they aren't whining. And most of us are very proud of you for all the shiny objects you are getting and all the money, but that wasn't our biggest concern. You keep getting really excited about the money part, but don't acknowledge the fact that the xp part is not as "enjoyable" as it used to be but is more of a chore, and was changed really for no reason.

These changes just make the financial divide even larger.
Wed 20 Nov 2019 5:31 AM by Wasted_Content
Nothing is fixed. IN FACT - everything I predicted to happen on Hibernia has happened.

1) Housing is cleared of XP items now because rich people bought all the items. Now the same rich people are camping and farming all the XP item spots with their animists and price gouging the shit out of the market. Exp items are 500g a stack now.

2) All the farm spots are consistently camped by animists and mentalists.

3) No one is rolling tanks or stealthers or healers or ANYTHING else, can you guess why? They all rolled animists so they could farm XP items.

4) Instead of grouping and levelling, people are just farming XP items or tokens and Xfering them to toons. Log in, turn in a few tokens, log out until task resets. So less people are grouping. Was that the intention? It SEEMS like, from all the staff response I've seen, that it was not.

The rich get richer, the poor get poorer...then they roll an animist of their own. And now everything is camped 24/7 by animists.
Wed 20 Nov 2019 7:19 AM by Wolfir666
Torye wrote:
Tue 19 Nov 2019 3:57 PM
Falcon your post are interesting but pretty much focus on how much of a boon this new leveling system is to someone that wants to make money and keeps dismissing the fact that it was much more "balanced" between making money and leveling before on the old system. While I think it's great that your dreams of getting shiny objects and oodles of money are being fulfilled, it doesn't change the fact that we used to be able to level up in 24 ish hours played and now that time has been doubled. Denigrating others for pointing out the fact that this change was nether asked for nor is it understandable as to why leveling up was made harder is just counter productive on this post. People are asking questions, they aren't whining. And most of us are very proud of you for all the shiny objects you are getting and all the money, but that wasn't our biggest concern. You keep getting really excited about the money part, but don't acknowledge the fact that the xp part is not as "enjoyable" as it used to be but is more of a chore, and was changed really for no reason.

So very very true.
But to be honest, the whole topic was already mentioned in several threads since then, i also did write a lot of words about all of that as well as many others, and the majority of those that posted here dislike the change of xp-items a lot.
Just... that it doesn't seem to have any effect, as the Devs already posted that it was "working as intended".
Yes, they made the game a lot less interesting for leveling up, that is, why i stopped putting in much effort into that lately.
But who knows, maybe they will revert the changes again, once people spent a lot of their unused plats to empty the housing-merchants of xp-items.
Or they never will change it, making the server even less interesting for newcomers, who just quickly want to go into RvR.
Wed 20 Nov 2019 7:23 AM by gotwqqd
Wasted_Content wrote:
Wed 20 Nov 2019 5:31 AM
Nothing is fixed. IN FACT - everything I predicted to happen on Hibernia has happened.

1) Housing is cleared of XP items now because rich people bought all the items. Now the same rich people are camping and farming all the XP item spots with their animists and price gouging the shit out of the market. Exp items are 500g a stack now.

2) All the farm spots are consistently camped by animists and mentalists.

3) No one is rolling tanks or stealthers or healers or ANYTHING else, can you guess why? They all rolled animists so they could farm XP items.

4) Instead of grouping and levelling, people are just farming XP items or tokens and Xfering them to toons. Log in, turn in a few tokens, log out until task resets. So less people are grouping. Was that the intention? It SEEMS like, from all the staff response I've seen, that it was not.

The rich get richer, the poor get poorer...then they roll an animist of their own. And now everything is camped 24/7 by animists.
It’s like they are forcing you to level up multiple classes at once without really playing them. Just gathering on a few select classes. Not enjoyable at all.
Wed 20 Nov 2019 6:51 PM by Wasted_Content
Can 100% confirm that just AoE farming XP items with a 50 (or a 35 if you're really trying to min/max just make another farmer and keep them lower level to AoE farm low level XP items) and Xferring them is much faster than grouping. Especially considering extra time waiting for a support class, trying to find a new spot, getting ganked, and praying your group can handle 4+ mobs at once.
Fri 22 Nov 2019 3:52 PM by falcon
Wasted_Content wrote:
Wed 20 Nov 2019 6:51 PM
Can 100% confirm that just AoE farming XP items with a 50 (or a 35 if you're really trying to min/max just make another farmer and keep them lower level to AoE farm low level XP items) and Xferring them is much faster than grouping. Especially considering extra time waiting for a support class, trying to find a new spot, getting ganked, and praying your group can handle 4+ mobs at once.

I already answered to this question in another post, farming give about 120 xp item / hour (80 drop 40 bought with loot/salvage) so about 5 levels to your toon (any level)

So if u can do better in group (and I'm sure u can do under 30) group >> farming
If u can't do better in group (and I'm sure u cant above level 30-35) farming >> group
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