Have the classes become more balanced? Realms?

Started 10 Jan 2021
by SaintRon
in Tavern
So as I was thinking about playing these questions came to mind. My biggest gripe when playing DAoC is that we have a quite amazing range of classes that gets me nostalgic, but then when I get in game ~50% are "trash" or "unviable". I'm not talking a nuanced view, but the general view. It doesn't do any good for a class to be fun/effective when the general view is that it's not useful.

It's like thinking of an ex.... she was so pretty and fun to hang out with.... but she cheated on you.

Are the realms relatively balanced in terms of skill/participation? (I like all realms)
Sun 10 Jan 2021 5:29 AM by joshisanonymous
They've done a pretty good job here of making most classes and playstyles viable. It's certainly more balanced in this respect that Uthgard; I can't speak for how it compares to what Live is currently like, though.
Sun 10 Jan 2021 7:55 AM by SaintRon
joshisanonymous wrote:
Sun 10 Jan 2021 5:29 AM
They've done a pretty good job here of making most classes and playstyles viable. It's certainly more balanced in this respect that Uthgard; I can't speak for how it compares to what Live is currently like, though.

Thanks man. Yeah I know they are at least trying. Last time I tried playing it took a long time to figure out the real values of what was going on.
Thu 21 Jan 2021 7:51 PM by Siouxsie
Server is heavily oriented towards casters, and then mostly Alb and Hib.
Midgard is like the third wheel nobody wanted and gets nerfed/neglected.
Thu 21 Jan 2021 9:45 PM by ExcretusMaximus
Siouxsie wrote:
Thu 21 Jan 2021 7:51 PM
Server is heavily oriented towards casters, and then mostly Alb and Hib.
Midgard is like the third wheel nobody wanted and gets nerfed/neglected.

Midgard classes are awesome, it's not the devs' fault that Midgard players all hate each other, have tight cliques who refuse to work together, and would rather sit in the relic town AFK suicide tasking than actually play the game.
Thu 21 Jan 2021 10:11 PM by mattymc
ExcretusMaximus wrote:
Thu 21 Jan 2021 9:45 PM
Siouxsie wrote:
Thu 21 Jan 2021 7:51 PM
Server is heavily oriented towards casters, and then mostly Alb and Hib.
Midgard is like the third wheel nobody wanted and gets nerfed/neglected.

Midgard classes are awesome, it's not the devs' fault that Midgard players all hate each other, have tight cliques who refuse to work together, and would rather sit in the relic town AFK suicide tasking than actually play the game.

Laughable..but expected.

Balance needs work...from the very beginning decisions were made that need to be revisited --- especially in regards to MID...they seem to be trying but I really can't fathom the order of their attempts.
Thu 21 Jan 2021 10:33 PM by Astaa
No, the game is very far from being balanced, unfortunately. The target audience appears to be 8v8, despite very few people caring about 8v8. Various balance issues that get justified by their need for 8v8, mincers being the prime example, ludicrously overpowered in 1v1, tedious AF in a zerg but probably about right in the minority sport of 8v8.

It is what it is though, enjoy what you can, or do something else.
Sat 23 Jan 2021 2:11 AM by SaintRon
ExcretusMaximus wrote:
Thu 21 Jan 2021 9:45 PM
Siouxsie wrote:
Thu 21 Jan 2021 7:51 PM
Server is heavily oriented towards casters, and then mostly Alb and Hib.
Midgard is like the third wheel nobody wanted and gets nerfed/neglected.

Midgard classes are awesome, it's not the devs' fault that Midgard players all hate each other, have tight cliques who refuse to work together, and would rather sit in the relic town AFK suicide tasking than actually play the game.

Before I stopped playing I saw some terrible personalities/egos on the mid side usually in leadership type roles.
Sat 23 Jan 2021 8:19 AM by Lollie
Not sure how long ago you stopped but mid has some nice leaders now, Nordia and Ellesar to name a couple. No egos amongst them which is a refreshing change from play hib/alb
Sat 23 Jan 2021 1:06 PM by Tool73
Never saw such an unbalanced server like this here, for shure gm`s have to compensate something from their live experience at 1.65 loosing constantly with their albion/hib toons....

but u can easy read it on your own, read the last 5 patches, or the 5 before, or the 5 before....massiv upgrades for alb/hib, some not really important changes to mid....

they just had to correct an AOE Dot for Wizzards, makeing the server completly collapse to albion in zerg play.
Sat 23 Jan 2021 2:55 PM by ExcretusMaximus
mattymc wrote:
Thu 21 Jan 2021 10:11 PM
Laughable..but expected.

I've got 7 million RP worth of experience on Midgard on this server, I know what the culture is like there.
Sat 23 Jan 2021 6:32 PM by mattymc
ExcretusMaximus wrote:
Sat 23 Jan 2021 2:55 PM
mattymc wrote:
Thu 21 Jan 2021 10:11 PM
Laughable..but expected.

I've got 7 million RP worth of experience on Midgard on this server, I know what the culture is like there.

Yeah, and, so???...no use comparing RP's on realms but your experience is not universal. There are people like that on all realms <heck, prolly the same people since a bunch of mids are playing on alb and hib quite a bit>. When there is a perception of getting the short end of every single decision, actions reflect that.....I will refrain from any bias comment but I sure as heck think MANY decisions right from the start are quite hard to justify. Ultimately, look at the results --- if there is no way to get ahead in the Realm War people will do all the alternatives that are set up for them; why shouldn't they especially if they feel they are getting the short end of EVERY decision.
IMO it's not just class or realm balance, but a host of things that contribute to the mess. And ignoring the realm that is getting gut punched every single day while making changes to the winners that are helping them even more....sure, patience is a virtue, but it's hard not to think a little common sense in the order of things would solve a lot of problems. Oh well, it's free ....
Sun 24 Jan 2021 2:17 AM by CowwoC
There is no point in buffing mid without putting any thoughts into it. People just will shift from alb/ hib over to mid till mid gets nerfed, because the people from alb and mid are missing in their realms and mid dominates because of the numbers and buffs. Then, after a nerf, the loop will start again and people switch back to hib/alb. People who main hib and alb will most likely never switch to mid and main it unless they are buffed over the edge and stay buffed to compensate that mid feels way more toxic, elitist and butt hurt than alb or hib. Its not a matter of weak classes in general, tho i agree that mid needed the last patches, but a matter of peoples mindset. Mid has intern problems with some guilds and people in general, you can just applause all those people who actually put effort into it and try to start bgs in mid, even tho mid feels like a pit full of snakes.

Not all mids are like that, thats for sure - but mid still does not feel as a whole realm. I started in mid, left it and now play it again - and it's still the same feeling as it was(in rvr). If you are not part of a specific inner circle, people will make it hard for you to be accepted. Mid has no persistent bg lead, who is online as much pilz and polemo are and mids don't care much if their fz gets attacked, actually i have no clue what mids are doing meanwhile but many just stay afk in relic town(but the other realms have that problem too), doing their flag circles and only start repainting their fz when polemo and pilz left. And yes at eu prime mids get outnumbered by albs and hibs, but again - that's not because mid is the weakest realm in terms of classes.
Sun 24 Jan 2021 9:12 AM by SaintRon
Tool73 wrote:
Sat 23 Jan 2021 1:06 PM
Never saw such an unbalanced server like this here, for shure gm`s have to compensate something from their live experience at 1.65 loosing constantly with their albion/hib toons....

but u can easy read it on your own, read the last 5 patches, or the 5 before, or the 5 before....massiv upgrades for alb/hib, some not really important changes to mid....

they just had to correct an AOE Dot for Wizzards, makeing the server completly collapse to albion in zerg play.

Mid was pretty messed up leader wise before any patches as far as I remember. The whole "I'm an important person in an alliance cross me and I'll try to ruin your rep" nonsense.
Mon 25 Jan 2021 1:14 PM by borodino1812
CowwoC wrote:
Sun 24 Jan 2021 2:17 AM
There is no point in buffing mid without putting any thoughts into it. People just will shift from alb/ hib over to mid till mid gets nerfed, because the people from alb and mid are missing in their realms and mid dominates because of the numbers and buffs. Then, after a nerf, the loop will start again and people switch back to hib/alb. People who main hib and alb will most likely never switch to mid and main it unless they are buffed over the edge and stay buffed to compensate that mid feels way more toxic, elitist and butt hurt than alb or hib. Its not a matter of weak classes in general, tho i agree that mid needed the last patches, but a matter of peoples mindset. Mid has intern problems with some guilds and people in general, you can just applause all those people who actually put effort into it and try to start bgs in mid, even tho mid feels like a pit full of snakes.

Not all mids are like that, thats for sure - but mid still does not feel as a whole realm. I started in mid, left it and now play it again - and it's still the same feeling as it was(in rvr). If you are not part of a specific inner circle, people will make it hard for you to be accepted. Mid has no persistent bg lead, who is online as much pilz and polemo are and mids don't care much if their fz gets attacked, actually i have no clue what mids are doing meanwhile but many just stay afk in relic town(but the other realms have that problem too), doing their flag circles and only start repainting their fz when polemo and pilz left. And yes at eu prime mids get outnumbered by albs and hibs, but again - that's not because mid is the weakest realm in terms of classes.

I think this is a fair comment. For the first time in months, I've been able to play mid in NA prime time, and it is a world of difference to the struggle that is Euro prime time. It is simply easier for a casual player to have a quick BG fix in Alb or Hib. That results in skewed numbers for mid, but it is to a certain extent a problem of the realm's own making.
Tue 26 Jan 2021 9:25 AM by byron
SaintRon wrote:
Sun 10 Jan 2021 1:47 AM
Are the realms relatively balanced in terms of skill/participation? (I like all realms)

It depends on your playstile. For zerg and keep fighting Alb and Hib are more organized, Mid has quite always 0 relics and no numbers in EU time to take them back. The skill depends on the player and not on the realm but I would say that , if you like a damage dealer class, a caster at the moment is what to choose : more effective in 8vs8 and less boring in keep fighting. But we don't know so much what you like
Tue 26 Jan 2021 7:18 PM by Yol
Balance ?

- Minstrels got insta-pet-charm 2000 range, minstrels are cc-immun with a pet...just release it , let it hit you and recharm instant...LOL
- Paladins allways endu-song + any other song same time and 2000 range. Now the paladin got 2 insta-grp-heals (really?)
- Shaman endu-buff 1000 range and cost conz
- BD 6sec Lifetap (was 4 sec on that patch-range) and no pet-demezz and no /formation-order Mainpet only Melee and low HP or it bugs all around the map. Healpets are a bad-joke.

MUCH Alb-Love on theis server....and midgard is the realm with nothing....

I would donate some money....i payed 26 Euro a month on live-server...no problem with that. But i dont donate for unbalancing like that!

You can see it EVERY day : Albs and hibs get all keeps in midgard...easy rps for them. Or just watch where the relics are! To make it much more easy get the relics: Now the relics are not behind a wall. It is so ridiculous!
Tue 26 Jan 2021 9:05 PM by Blitze
Skalds are on higher WS table and have access to Det here.
Mid has spec AF buff (healer I think)
Thanes have a resist debuff proc for their own dmg
Hunters escaped recent bow dmg nerf.
SuppBd has baseline DD
SB can triple stack 3 DoTs on you
Tue 26 Jan 2021 9:51 PM by MeatBicycle
Blitze wrote:
Tue 26 Jan 2021 9:05 PM
Skalds are on higher WS table and have access to Det here.
Mid has spec AF buff (healer I think)
Thanes have a resist debuff proc for their own dmg
Hunters escaped recent bow dmg nerf.
SuppBd has baseline DD
SB can triple stack 3 DoTs on you

Skalds may have higher WS and Det, but in my opinion for 8man / zerg they are the most useless speed class of the 3 realms.
SBs may have triple dot, but no sidestun or direct after evade stun. And they don't have the chance to use anything other than slash (but yeah, the offhand swings 100% of the hits )
There was no reason to nerf hunter bow dmg since they have the shortest range and the weakest bow dmg by far

But i guess i see what you did here. Its an endless discussion about pro and contra and it is almost impossible to be objective.
Wed 27 Jan 2021 12:22 AM by Yol
Blitze wrote:
Tue 26 Jan 2021 9:05 PM
Skalds are on higher WS table and have access to Det here.
Mid has spec AF buff (healer I think)
Thanes have a resist debuff proc for their own dmg
Hunters escaped recent bow dmg nerf.
SuppBd has baseline DD
SB can triple stack 3 DoTs on you

Just watch the Warmap and /relic Then pls explain me what of your arguments above will be overpowerd.
Wed 27 Jan 2021 1:49 AM by SaintRon
Yol wrote:
Wed 27 Jan 2021 12:22 AM
Blitze wrote:
Tue 26 Jan 2021 9:05 PM
Skalds are on higher WS table and have access to Det here.
Mid has spec AF buff (healer I think)
Thanes have a resist debuff proc for their own dmg
Hunters escaped recent bow dmg nerf.
SuppBd has baseline DD
SB can triple stack 3 DoTs on you

Just watch the Warmap and /relic Then pls explain me what of your arguments above will be overpowerd.

I think he's saying it's a leader/teamwork issue.
Wed 27 Jan 2021 10:20 AM by Astaa
Do Mid even have a BG leader atm? I'm not on a lot atm due to workload but when I am it always seems to be different people in 'Keep captured by <name>'
Thu 28 Jan 2021 12:54 AM by mattymc
Astaa wrote:
Wed 27 Jan 2021 10:20 AM
Do Mid even have a BG leader atm? I'm not on a lot atm due to workload but when I am it always seems to be different people in 'Keep captured by <name>'

it seems mostly the Euro mids <time wise> don't and NA mostly does....that is just how it appears atm.

The larger point is it's a 2 realm game --- which is painful, since usually the 2 realms with greater pop tend to beat up on the 3rd cause it's easy -- this is a problem that should be addressed. The reality is there are balance issues and there are leadership issues --- which is controlling; hard to know, but it seems that addressing mid issues would be a higher priority then it has appeared to be so far.
Fri 29 Jan 2021 11:12 AM by Siouxsie
I have no idea what Mid is like during NA times as I am asleep, but during EU times, it's painful to be out in the frontier.
The other night both Hibs and Albs had 100+ roaming around and working together (they would strategically avoid each other).
Meanwhile, Mids would have something like 53 in the battlegroup, but there would be only 2 full groups actually with the BG leader.

Mids would rather AFK in Relic town, or run their 8 mans than do anything in the frontier. This is a core problem with the player base.

Some Mids actually do try to counter the Albs and Hibs, but when you get wiped over and over and over by Albs or Hibs, it gets boring and un-fun fast and.. /quit
Fri 29 Jan 2021 2:09 PM by mattymc
Siouxsie wrote:
Fri 29 Jan 2021 11:12 AM
I have no idea what Mid is like during NA times as I am asleep, but during EU times, it's painful to be out in the frontier.
The other night both Hibs and Albs had 100+ roaming around and working together (they would strategically avoid each other).
Meanwhile, Mids would have something like 53 in the battlegroup, but there would be only 2 full groups actually with the BG leader.

Mids would rather AFK in Relic town, or run their 8 mans than do anything in the frontier. This is a core problem with the player base.

Some Mids actually do try to counter the Albs and Hibs, but when you get wiped over and over and over by Albs or Hibs, it gets boring and un-fun fast and.. /quit

So the question would be why? Is Large scale RvR too devalued? Are balance issues overarching or is t a combo of those and others. One thing for sure, Mid has issues as a realm --- when any will addressed from OUTSIDE the players --- who knows.
Fri 29 Jan 2021 5:02 PM by Sepplord
Currently it is surely a Devils circle or self fulfilling Prophecy

Zergplayers have gone to other realms because there just is no zerg most of the time in mid.
Fri 29 Jan 2021 6:54 PM by mattymc
Sepplord wrote:
Fri 29 Jan 2021 5:02 PM
Currently it is surely a Devils circle or self fulfilling Prophecy

Zergplayers have gone to other realms because there just is no zerg most of the time in mid.

Certainly one theory, but WHY no zerg and can anything be done about it.

Also, why does a realm with nothing to defend have keeps worth RP <just another factor of running to easy RP as another possible or probable factor>.... It's not just as simple as one thing and SOME recognition of that fact, as changes are made, might be useful....
Fri 29 Jan 2021 6:58 PM by ExcretusMaximus
The same people telling me I'm an idiot in the beginning of the thread are saying the same thing I was, now.

Sat 30 Jan 2021 11:57 AM by Siouxsie
mattymc wrote:
Fri 29 Jan 2021 2:09 PM
So the question would be why? Is Large scale RvR too devalued? Are balance issues overarching or is t a combo of those and others. One thing for sure, Mid has issues as a realm --- when any will addressed from OUTSIDE the players --- who knows.

It's a number of factors, but mostly it's EU Mid player attitude -- they would rather do things on their own, whether that is GVG 8 mans or just doing flag tasks and AFKing. Experience tells them if they try to make a BG during EU times, no one shows up.. so Albs and HIbs just steamroll them. Most of the Alb and Hib groups running around at EU times are RR11+ and have tons of tools and pets at their disposal to dispatch Mids who have seen their abilities get weakened and worse, while Alb and Hib get buffs and extra tools and tricks they shouldn't have gotten in the first place.

Autumn of 2019, Midgard was dominating all the time. Then for whatever reason, the people who were really good Mid players either stopped playing, or went to Alb/Hib. Now, it seems there's a giant influx of Mids who just don't seem to know how to play their classes. You join groups for a BG and you get healers and shamans who don't seem to know how to heal or buff properly, you get overextending happening all the time, by Alb and Hib groups that are high RR who just love it when Mids try to run after their kiting.

When Mids do manage to get in to a tower to retake it, you get hib bomb groups with multiple TWFs, Static tempests and NMs that just wipe everyone, so they don't bother rejoining the BG. Why rejoin when you're just going to get steamrolled over and over and over?

Alb and Hib have much more of a zerg mentality -- that's why they always hold the relics.

The new relic system was a big mistake. Nerfing Midgard was a big mistake. Giving 2 hib classes static tempest and giving hib and alb tons of 'balancing' tools they shouldn't have has made them overwhelmingly overpowered.

Now you get Pilz taking Nott, Polemo taking Bled.. and making their way across the Mid frontier because they know Mids won't defend their keeps. The NA Mids then log in and have to retake it all over again.

People constantly asking in region chat "Why is Polemo here? There's no relics here."
Polemo doesn't care.. he and Pilz will happily work together to turn the Mid frontier red and green because it's the easy way out. They don't want to fight each other.

I think last night was the last time they decided to actually fight each other, only until after taking about 5 towers and opening Sursbrooke, did Polemo's zerg of lemmings pour over Sursbrooke the kill the very meager (in comparison) Midgard BG.. because it was easy, because of the lulz.. who knows. Polemo hates Midgard since they spurned him.

What a toxic player base here.
Sat 30 Jan 2021 2:39 PM by mattymc
Siouxsie wrote:
Sat 30 Jan 2021 11:57 AM
mattymc wrote:
Fri 29 Jan 2021 2:09 PM
So the question would be why? Is Large scale RvR too devalued? Are balance issues overarching or is t a combo of those and others. One thing for sure, Mid has issues as a realm --- when any will addressed from OUTSIDE the players --- who knows.

It's a number of factors, but mostly it's EU Mid player attitude -- they would rather do things on their own, whether that is GVG 8 mans or just doing flag tasks and AFKing. Experience tells them if they try to make a BG during EU times, no one shows up.. so Albs and HIbs just steamroll them. Most of the Alb and Hib groups running around at EU times are RR11+ and have tons of tools and pets at their disposal to dispatch Mids who have seen their abilities get weakened and worse, while Alb and Hib get buffs and extra tools and tricks they shouldn't have gotten in the first place.

Autumn of 2019, Midgard was dominating all the time. Then for whatever reason, the people who were really good Mid players either stopped playing, or went to Alb/Hib. Now, it seems there's a giant influx of Mids who just don't seem to know how to play their classes. You join groups for a BG and you get healers and shamans who don't seem to know how to heal or buff properly, you get overextending happening all the time, by Alb and Hib groups that are high RR who just love it when Mids try to run after their kiting.

When Mids do manage to get in to a tower to retake it, you get hib bomb groups with multiple TWFs, Static tempests and NMs that just wipe everyone, so they don't bother rejoining the BG. Why rejoin when you're just going to get steamrolled over and over and over?

Alb and Hib have much more of a zerg mentality -- that's why they always hold the relics.

The new relic system was a big mistake. Nerfing Midgard was a big mistake. Giving 2 hib classes static tempest and giving hib and alb tons of 'balancing' tools they shouldn't have has made them overwhelmingly overpowered.

Now you get Pilz taking Nott, Polemo taking Bled.. and making their way across the Mid frontier because they know Mids won't defend their keeps. The NA Mids then log in and have to retake it all over again.

People constantly asking in region chat "Why is Polemo here? There's no relics here."
Polemo doesn't care.. he and Pilz will happily work together to turn the Mid frontier red and green because it's the easy way out. They don't want to fight each other.

I think last night was the last time they decided to actually fight each other, only until after taking about 5 towers and opening Sursbrooke, did Polemo's zerg of lemmings pour over Sursbrooke the kill the very meager (in comparison) Midgard BG.. because it was easy, because of the lulz.. who knows. Polemo hates Midgard since they spurned him.

What a toxic player base here.

Perhaps if the GM's would consider fixing some of the mistakes and stop worrying about a player bias and look inward at the possibility of their own some of these things would resolve themselves.
Sat 30 Jan 2021 2:43 PM by mattymc
ExcretusMaximus wrote:
Fri 29 Jan 2021 6:58 PM
The same people telling me I'm an idiot in the beginning of the thread are saying the same thing I was, now.



As usual, you get it wrong --- Your blame was squarely on the players in Mid....it is simply way more complicated than that....if the DEVS do their part, which they haven't imo <not JUST in Balance but in managing the core of the Game which is true RvR>, perhaps there would be changes in attitudes and numbers.
Sat 30 Jan 2021 2:59 PM by Simon73
The fact that ZERG is not good on Mid it's not a GM's problem.

If you do gvg list, normally 5-6p mid, 6-7alb and maybe 1 hib.
So mechanics is not a problem.


So, don't blame GM's.. blame who sent away Polemo from Mid and now you're not able to follow a new leader.
Sun 31 Jan 2021 12:18 AM by mattymc
Simon73 wrote:
Sat 30 Jan 2021 2:59 PM
The fact that ZERG is not good on Mid it's not a GM's problem.

If you do gvg list, normally 5-6p mid, 6-7alb and maybe 1 hib.
So mechanics is not a problem.


So, don't blame GM's.. blame who sent away Polemo from Mid and now you're not able to follow a new leader.

Neither a GvG list nor Polemo <or anyone else for that matter (ego's are so fragile) roaming around to find followers is dispositive of anything
Sun 31 Jan 2021 2:11 AM by Freedomcall
You won't believe how many mid players die to oil everyday.
And those people who died doesn't seem to improve.
Same people die to oil again and again for no reason.

Yeah, you can make so many excuses about why Midgard is "systemically" weak in zerg.
But basically, nothing can help a realm that doesn't learn to play.

Yesterday on NA time, like 15 mids died to an oil on a "single" tower.
Of course, hibs pushed out as soon as they saw that many mids dying and, of course, mid BG wiped again.
I just couldn't believe my eyes.
No realm can win if you play like that.

Anyway, for the OP: if you pug small/8, I can assure you that you can have fun in any realm.
Sun 31 Jan 2021 4:30 PM by mattymc
Freedomcall wrote:
Sun 31 Jan 2021 2:11 AM
You won't believe how many mid players die to oil everyday.
And those people who died doesn't seem to improve.
Same people die to oil again and again for no reason.

Yeah, you can make so many excuses about why Midgard is "systemically" weak in zerg.
But basically, nothing can help a realm that doesn't learn to play.

Yesterday on NA time, like 15 mids died to an oil on a "single" tower.
Of course, hibs pushed out as soon as they saw that many mids dying and, of course, mid BG wiped again.
I just couldn't believe my eyes.
No realm can win if you play like that.

Anyway, for the OP: if you pug small/8, I can assure you that you can have fun in any realm.

While true of all realms, I, too, saw that spam , really kind of hilarious.....
Mon 1 Feb 2021 8:29 AM by Sepplord
So, do the players not learn because they are mids...or have the players that learn left mid for the better zerg-realms?
I am not saying my explanation is the correct one (there are tons of other just as likely ones), but it surely is more reasonable than the "midgard just has less skilled players in general" explanation.
Imo, whenever you reach explanations that assume issues in playerbases to be rooted in one realm just generally having less skilled players, you are probably wrong.
Wed 3 Feb 2021 8:35 PM by Blitze
Friars have become more balanced in many ways compared to most servers/patch lvls.

They are More balanced Vs stealths I.e. not the complete anti-stealth killer here.
They are now more balanced in 8v8 I.e. they get picked for 2nd cleric spot sometimes.
Tue 9 Feb 2021 6:09 PM by Siouxsie
Blitze wrote:
Wed 3 Feb 2021 8:35 PM
Friars have become more balanced in many ways compared to most servers/patch lvls.

They are More balanced Vs stealths I.e. not the complete anti-stealth killer here.
They are now more balanced in 8v8 I.e. they get picked for 2nd cleric spot sometimes.

Not really. Friars could use tuning downwards to make them more balanced.
Like all Alb classes they received too much love from the devs.
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