Why Old Frontiers was Better - Phoenix Freeshard

The answer is simple really. Accessibility.

In OF we had Emain. If you wanted to find instant action, you could always find it in Emain. Midgard and Albion had constant action right outside their player keeps.
The objectives were simple. Capture a few keeps and flags. We eventually were able to teleport to flags in Breifine, which solved some of the Milegate troubles.
OF was not perfect, in fact it was incredibly flawed. However, OF was more accessible for casual players. It was easier to navigate and better at directing players towards the action.

Boats in New Frontier solved some of the problems with OF Milegates, but the RvR in NF is aimless. NF is too confusing and spread out.

Mon 16 Mar 2020 11:40 PM by mattymc

It's more the instant ability to form a zerg and dominate by hopping realm to realm -- which is exactly what is happened. Follow that with then everyone avoiding the BIGGEST BULLY and just doing 'tasks for RP as opposed to punishing the biggest zerg. NF or OF --- the crapola would be the same.

Tue 17 Mar 2020 12:34 AM by Forlornhope

If you think OF's better there's a whole 30 people playing a server built around it. They can not and will not ever go back to OF. I don't know why these posts keep popping up, other than to stir the pot.. But, you SOL sorry bud.

Tue 17 Mar 2020 6:29 AM by inoeth

defiasbandit wrote: ↑
Mon 16 Mar 2020 11:23 PM
The answer is simple really. Accessibility.

In OF we had Emain. If you wanted to find instant action, you could always find it in Emain. Midgard and Albion had constant action right outside their player keeps.
The objectives were simple. Capture a few keeps and flags. We eventually were able to teleport to flags in Breifine, which solved some of the Milegate troubles.
OF was not perfect, in fact it was incredibly flawed. However, OF was more accessible for casual players. It was easier to navigate and better at directing players towards the action.

Boats in New Frontier solved some of the problems with OF Milegates, but the RvR in NF is too aimless. NF is too confusing and spread out.

in fact nf has much more instant action possibility than of, especially for hibs. but, its the dumb zerg players who ruin it by raiding every fkn keep and destroy porters. sometime i log in and see that there is one tower of every keep captured by another realm. this is killing all the action!

OF sucks

Tue 17 Mar 2020 1:44 PM by Fugax

Its all in the eye of the beholder IMO. DAOC's rvr system was made for the player to create his/her own adventure. So basically you figure out how you want to create/make your rvr. It wasn't until the server put in these "RVR Tasks" when RVR became "controlled". Prior to these people didn't need places of interest to make action, it just happened. With these tasks came a flood of choke points in both OF and NF where players sit and camp, and dont stray far from the objective in hopes to get some free realm points for doing nothing at all. I personally miss the old organic RVR that just happend without being told where to gather and go afk to get boosted rps for hanging out. thats just my two cents.

Tue 17 Mar 2020 2:29 PM by MrWolf

useless post, they said 300000 times that they cannot and they won't go back to OF

Tue 17 Mar 2020 6:43 PM by joshisanonymous

I don't buy that OF was better for casuals. On both Uthgard and here, with OF, what I remember was elite 8v8 being the only game in town, especially on Uthgard without tasks. It was better here since the tasks were easy RPs so casuals were more willing to come out, but I mostly remember 8mans and not much else (i.e., nothing smaller, nothing bigger).

Mon 23 Mar 2020 1:05 AM by 2flare

If they hadn't proposed NF at all, then nobody would have given a fuck and people would have stayed. Instead they "proposed it" which split the community. Eventually the OFers left... It was a dumb ass move. Nobody joined Phoenix thinking "hey a new server with NF in it, nice". We all came here expecting OF until they flipped the script on us. Once they put it on the table, the obvious happened it split the community. "But people voted NF" yeah but a SIGNIFICANT proportion did NOT and the entire server population JOINED knowing and being told it was a OF server. Doesn't take einstein to figure out what happened once they changed it. Worst of all, the NFers and mods want to silence you for speaking your opinion about it or at the very least quite rude very often when someone speaks out. Yeah its our right ffs. That's the whole reason I joined this server FOR OF which it was initially but after investing months on this server they shafted us. At the very least, let us OFers voice our complaints without being dismissed like we're second class players here. I swear this forum is a joke. People getting flamed for saying they dont like NF? Get real. Let the man speak in peace instead of being belligerent towards him.

Mon 23 Mar 2020 2:05 AM by thirian24

I've written walls about OF and NF before, so I'll shorten it up.

The only people that liked OF was the hardcore 8man and Albs/Mids because at a certain point nobody left emain. That meant they had instant port to action 24/7. OF is a fucking joke, stop crying like a bitch about it.

Mon 23 Mar 2020 5:46 AM by Forlornhope

2flare wrote: ↑
Mon 23 Mar 2020 1:05 AM
If they hadn't proposed NF at all, then nobody would have given a fuck and people would have stayed. Instead they "proposed it" which split the community. Eventually the OFers left... It was a dumb ass move. Nobody joined Phoenix thinking "hey a new server with NF in it, nice". We all came here expecting OF until they flipped the script on us. Once they put it on the table, the obvious happened it split the community. "But people voted NF" yeah but a SIGNIFICANT proportion did NOT and the entire server population JOINED knowing and being told it was a OF server. Doesn't take einstein to figure out what happened once they changed it. Worst of all, the NFers and mods want to silence you for speaking your opinion about it or at the very least quite rude very often when someone speaks out. Yeah its our right ffs. That's the whole reason I joined this server FOR OF which it was initially but after investing months on this server they shafted us. At the very least, let us OFers voice our complaints without being dismissed like we're second class players here. I swear this forum is a joke. People getting flamed for saying they dont like NF? Get real. Let the man speak in peace instead of being belligerent towards him.

This server was one of my first experiences with an actually active OF. People always say stuff about the amount of players who left because of the switch, but people never seem to think about it much the other way. I probably wouldn't still be playing on this server if it was still OF, the two choke point zerg camping and high rr 8 mans camping the two portal keeps that you had to leave from was just getting ridiculous. Don't get me wrong, both zones have their flaws but the ones for NF are at least bearable for me and at least some of the hardcore OF community since they're still playing here. TBH though I don't think the problems on this server have anything to do with geography, or even the GMs and the decisions they have made for this server. But, I hope that you're still around and at least are enjoying this great game still man. Cheers.

Sun 12 Apr 2020 8:31 PM by Turano

thirian24 wrote: ↑
Mon 23 Mar 2020 2:05 AM
I've written walls about OF and NF before, so I'll shorten it up.

The only people that liked OF was the hardcore 8man and Albs/Mids because at a certain point nobody left emain. That meant they had instant port to action 24/7. OF is a fucking joke, stop crying like a bitch about it.

what does that tell about me that I as a solo Hib prefered OF over NF?

Mon 13 Apr 2020 11:33 AM by Nunki

2flare wrote: ↑
Mon 23 Mar 2020 1:05 AM
If they hadn't proposed NF at all, then nobody would have given a fuck and people would have stayed. Instead they "proposed it" which split the community.

The live client changes were the main reason why they "proposed" NF. They had to bypass many things to make them work despite OF.
In terms of pending workload NF was the smartest choice.

2flare wrote: ↑
Mon 23 Mar 2020 1:05 AM
We all came here expecting OF until they flipped the script on us.

Total nonsense. About 62% of the community was obviously interested in NF, 38% was not interested in NF.
THE REST, those people who didn't vote at all, didn't care.
Stop talking as if your opinion would be the opinion of the whole server. It isn't, you obviously are a minority.

NF is most likely one of the reasons that this server still exists with such a population.

GM's are indeed interested in everyones opinion, but there is no way back to OF.
Probably due to 3 reasons:
- Too much work would have to be done to make OF work with the live client (This was an obvious attempt of live to stop freeshards).
- It doesn't make sense to start a voting, implement the opinion of the majority (losing a small fraction of the community) and afterwards redo it.
- OF was an assymetric and outdated zone. NF has more potential in every way.

Which is the reason that endless discussions about something that can't and won't happen, are not that welcome.

Mon 13 Apr 2020 11:43 AM by Noashakra

I OF was still here, I would not have lvl up my toons and would not be playing this game.
Do you take people like me into account?

Mon 13 Apr 2020 3:55 PM by joshisanonymous

All OF really has going for it is nostalgia. Once that wears off, you're left with some pretty poor designs (e.g., people avoid Pennine like the plague for a reason). NF definitely affords more room for different gameplay styles and is much more dynamic. I mean, some people played OF for a long time and never even learned how to get around zones other than Emain because, ya know, why would you bother?

Tue 14 Apr 2020 8:37 AM by Sepplord

Pesonally i like the current state of the maps and the options of getting around compared to OF...
But the vote that happened didn't clarify that the NF that was being voted for would not have destructible walls/towers, which changes the siege of the RvR structures heavily. (Gruenes has explained many times why it is like it is, and i am not bashing them for it....but the vote was skewed)

Sun 19 Apr 2020 8:31 AM by Lance

joshisanonymous wrote: ↑
Tue 17 Mar 2020 6:43 PM
but I mostly remember 8mans and not much else (i.e., nothing smaller, nothing bigger).

https://imgur.com/a/40pz4fZ

Sun 19 Apr 2020 2:50 PM by joshisanonymous

Lance wrote: ↑
Sun 19 Apr 2020 8:31 AM
joshisanonymous wrote: ↑
Tue 17 Mar 2020 6:43 PM
but I mostly remember 8mans and not much else (i.e., nothing smaller, nothing bigger).

https://imgur.com/a/40pz4fZ

I'm guessing those were during tasks, which did help. I may be mixing up memories of Uthgard a bit with OF Phoenix since I'm pretty sure Phoenix always had those tasks? It wasn't until right before I took a long break that I remember actual zergs forming, though (i.e., those with a leader), at least in Mid. Oadin started leading them there, and then I don't know how long it took until NF came.

I still think OF was much less friendly to solos/smallmen if not casuals. There just weren't many places to go for that kind of action.

Sun 19 Apr 2020 4:01 PM by necrolove1

Nostalgia is great and all, but there is a reason NF was created, OF was flawed in many ways. And in NF the action is pretty easy to find, especially now with the flag tasks this is especially great if you have a full group, not so much for solo and sometimes smallman.

I made the suggestion below to try to help the spread of solo/smallman action take a look
https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=13239

It would be nice to have OF brought back in a week long event/competition. Just for the competition/nostalgia/reminder why its bad.

Sun 19 Apr 2020 4:13 PM by Forlornhope

necrolove1 wrote: ↑
Sun 19 Apr 2020 4:01 PM
Nostalgia is great and all, but there is a reason NF was created, OF was flawed in many ways. And in NF the action is pretty easy to find, especially now with the flag tasks this is especially great if you have a full group, not so much for solo and sometimes smallman.

I made the suggestion below to try to help the spread of solo/smallman action take a look
https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=13239

It would be nice to have OF brought back in a week long event/competition. Just for the competition/nostalgia/reminder why its bad.

I agree with this, imo if people really want the nostalgia they should set something up on the forums where a bunch of people make CV toons. Almost all of OF action was centered around emain, and CV has literally the same map. I think that their intentions was to give people CV to give them that old feel while simultaneously making it the molvik of the shard. No one really goes there though except to check who owns the keep to turn in xp items. I'd personally prefer molvik myself, maybe keep thid at 24 have molvik run at 30-34 or something like that and keep CV where it is.

Mon 20 Apr 2020 4:02 PM by Jeterix

There is a reason why NF was created? Then I guess there is a reason why ToA was created. Wait what?

OF was better and here is why:

1) Relic keeps. I remember having so many awesome fights at the triple door relic keeps. NF relic keeps are lame where is the door? And if you are attacking a relic keep it is a lot easier to cut off incoming from the border keep in OF that it is to cut off incoming from the relic town that is practically on top of the relic keep.

2)EV. Why are there towers in EV that control DF? Why do towers control DF. In OF you could actually get DF for your realm and hold it without having to take over half of the frontier.

3)boats. I haven't played in a while but we were chasing some people the other day and then they went up to one of our docks and some of them literally boated away from us using using our own dock.

4) OF RAs. Means that you can't RA dump every 5 minutes.

5)teleporting. Somehow it was fun to not to just teleport and run to the dock every time you spawn. Plus the old keep designs are way cool and you could upgrade the doors.

OF is so fun and it leads to great fights of all kinds.

Mon 20 Apr 2020 6:08 PM by Noashakra

Except for 1) I disagree with all the rest...
NF is great
Waiting at the TP 5mn is fun yeahhhhh