Re: Help for new Hunter

Good info Inoeth and gromet12, thanks.

The 42 BC seems to indeed add alot of melee-value with the added AF for defence and added Dex/Qui for the Spear.
But at range that value quickly diminishes..
The rapid fire info was an eye opener as well, I valued that too high.

Looking at it I still want to focus on Bow to begin with at low RR knowing that i'll probably end up face down in melee regardless of spec..
With Stealth 37 and Spear 39 I'll do some test between 45 Bow, 32 BC and 39 Bow, 42 BC.

Once i get some experience and RA tools under my belt I'll look towards 36 Stealh, Spear 44, Bow 31, BC 42 and stop avoiding melee at all cost.
A good selection of LT and/or DoT spears should help here as well.

What's your opinion on RA progression?
Tireless
Longwind
Purge 2
IP 2?
?

I did not know about the bubble-pop ability of Longshot, is it 50% or 100% that goes thru?
That's quite alot of added value that RA.
Is it worth going Longshot early if you're sub 40 bow spec for that reason only? Still worth it at 40+ bow spec?

Cheers!
tastic     ┬    oloco
            Zoc
smock   ┴    ter

Re: Help for new Hunter

The high BC or PF is always for the 250 qui. The other stats help but don't matter much. Str based weps increase ~1% per 4 points, so spear gets ~1% 8 points dex or 4 D/S.

I'd suggest taking BC/PF to whatever caps your Qui including MoA 1 or 2.

Bow DMG increased by ~0.5% from 51 to 52. It has been buffed considerably but for Rangers and Hunters you are still better off with 27 or 35 Bow, more if you have spare points. Mid I switch bows instead of using an ability. It is effectively the same without endo concerns. /switch works for bows, fyi. I have out shot Scouts with this. This also has the advantage of throwing a LT or some other favorable proc on the bow besides dot. For example, if you are in a clutch fight where firing fast actually matters it is likely to be the middle of the fight where both of you need health, where lifetap would come in handy.

Since the buff my hunter saw about ~50 more dmg per hit from 34 bow. Nice on crit shot opener for sins but not necessary.

Ultimately, you will be in melee most of your fights. Fights where your bow wins could be won with NS magic just as easily.
Pollojack FuwaFuwaTime - SB Frostbiter WasterOfDays - Hunter Ttoll - Shaman
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PurgeFTW - Necro Politicalgnome - Minst

Re: Help for new Hunter

gromet12 wrote:
Thu 9 Jul 2020 6:15 PM
Zocci wrote:
Thu 9 Jul 2020 3:59 PM
inoeth wrote:
Tue 7 Jul 2020 2:51 PM
gromet12 wrote:
Tue 7 Jul 2020 2:37 PM
Cadebrennus wrote:
Tue 7 Jul 2020 12:48 PM
Base damage DOES increase when using base styles with the base weapon. I know specifically from speccing and testing 50 Blades vs 50 Celtic Dual. Given equal Growth Rates each style will do the same damage.

Total dmg=base dmg + style dmg

If you use styles from that line then obviously style dmg will increase as it doesn’t cap. Base dmg does get “hard capped” unless a 2hander (which gets 2H bonus).

Style dmg is not the largest portion of the dmg formula, increasing style by a few points will raise the style dmg BUT it’s up to you to make the choice if it is worth it, some classes don’t have to make this choice, for example warriors have options along with zerkers, hunters though would do better imo stopping at a style (for the style) and balancing out archery/BC (42 for example for th higher AF) vs random points into weapon without style

Here it is explained on the archery changes, archery is melee base dmg only with no styles, it stopped increasing dmg except for the small 2hand bonus modifier which is why going above 52 gained so little for archers

wrote: The damage modifier formula will be changed for non-volley archery shots only and no longer cap at min(spec - 1, enemy level + 1) aka no longer cap at 52 in pvp situations. This alone will make a noticable difference between 27 and 50 bow spec while at the same time increasing the bow damage for higher specs without touching the current 27 bow damage.
Penetrating shot 2 will allow 50% of the damage to go through against self casted bt.

with the again toned down archery, i can assure you it is not going to help you alot to dump the points into archery that much. 35 bow is enough, you can even drop it to 27 easily and still deal good dmg. 42 bc is a must imo and then you have the points for 44+ spear. and if you want to be a decent hunter and not just a wall-add-archer then you want high weapon spec since you end up in melee 99% of your fights. also according to your statement to spec for the style, the 44 spear is one of the highest dmg styles in the game and also the lvl 50 is quite good if you can manage to land the side style in the first place.

Good points all around.
I'm suprised you say 42 BC is a must, or is that more a high RR type of deal?

Compared to what i thought was an absolute minimum, 32 for the last pet, you get:
Speed 165 -> 180 delve, 40->50sec
14 more AF
12 more dex/qui
24 more pet str/con

That means you sacrifice either 9 points in bow with 39 spear or 16 points with 44 spear:
(Considering 36 stealth @ RR4)
36S 44 spear 42BC = 31 Bow (Pen 1, No Rapid fire) (This reach composit 52 bow and Rapid Fire 1 @RR8)
36S 39 spear 42BC = 37 Bow (Pen 1, Rapid 1) (Composit bow 52 @RR5)
36S 44 spear 32BC = 41 Bow (Pen 2, Rapid 1)
36S 39 spear 32BC = 46 Bow (Pen 2, Rapid 2)

Is the bow damage really that horrible that 12 more dex/qui and 14 more AF outweights 9 or 16 points in bow? Or is it the scaling thats poor?
Are Pen. Arrow 2 and Rapid Fire 1 and 2 not good enough to value them in spec?
Is composite bow 52 not a must have?

Side note:
Is the 39 rear stun really worth following up with melee damage instead of trying to kite away?

My Hunter dinged 50 in the event and currently in the process of getting temped so my experience is limited at best..
Meanwhile during slow workhours I´m trying to gain some theoretical knowledge here on the forum.

Cheers


Pet str/con is worthless in most cases, your not going to stop to buff the pet when you cast them, you can roam with them out and play the tag-along game putting the pet in various areas, but yea

AF is nice because evade 3 isn't going to save you, you will evade around 1 n 5 swings vs most classes, that means you are taking dmg the other times as you have low defense. The AF buff helps lower that dmg some I used 42 spec AF with moa 4 to push the AF even higher (was almost 90 iirc), but that also buffed my potions at the time, which that no longer works. But spec 42 AF isn't just 14 higher than than 31 spec, you are forgetting spec buffs get 25% casted bonus, so its 80 AF for 42 spec vs 62 AF for 31 spec, and the dex/quick works same way. I did this so I could cap quickness more so than the dex, my hunter is sword as I think the styles are better than spear, HOWEVER most classes have purge which would ruin it anyways

For RF...there is no difference in time/dmg for RF (I actually don't recommend you use it tbh as a mid, just swap out a fast bow IMO using /switch). The difference is endo usage and its nothing to worry about since you have endo regen up anyways

Pen II is nice now, but I still dropped it after playing with the change. It allows you to pop self casted BT for 50% dmg reduction, I just invest in Longshot which doesn't do that do you and pops self BT




What is the fastest bow available to Hunters on Mid?
The Drunken Ranger!-keeping Devs honest since 2012
Also playing a dual-wielding Saracen
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsY42S8E3-bNo7koW7oFZug

The Drunken Ranger’s Guide to Drunken Rangery
https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=2902

Re: Help for new Hunter

inoeth wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 8:49 AM
4.0

That's what I thought but is it possible to get to the 1.5 speed cap using regular shot and a 4.0? The speed calculators I've used haven't shown this is possible (in reference to Pollojack's comment above)
The Drunken Ranger!-keeping Devs honest since 2012
Also playing a dual-wielding Saracen
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsY42S8E3-bNo7koW7oFZug

The Drunken Ranger’s Guide to Drunken Rangery
https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=2902

Re: Help for new Hunter

Cadebrennus wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 10:38 AM
inoeth wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 8:49 AM
4.0

That's what I thought but is it possible to get to the 1.5 speed cap using regular shot and a 4.0? The speed calculators I've used haven't shown this is possible (in reference to Pollojack's comment above)

Bow isn't affected by haste or celerity. It's not possible to cap bow speed. 4.0 bow with 250 quickness is at 2.4 speed, and if you get MoArchery 9 your 2.4speed would be 2.04 speed. Bow speed may not even have a cap but that is impossible to find out without being able to custom make a faster bow.

Re: Help for new Hunter

Bradekes wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 1:43 PM
Cadebrennus wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 10:38 AM
inoeth wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 8:49 AM
4.0

That's what I thought but is it possible to get to the 1.5 speed cap using regular shot and a 4.0? The speed calculators I've used haven't shown this is possible (in reference to Pollojack's comment above)

Bow isn't affected by haste or celerity. It's not possible to cap bow speed. 4.0 bow with 250 quickness is at 2.4 speed, and if you get MoArchery 9 your 2.4speed would be 2.04 speed. Bow speed may not even have a cap but that is impossible to find out without being able to custom make a faster bow.

would be interesting how much dmg you would do with 50 bow moarchery9 and a 4.0 bow... i can imagine it would be about 300 every 2s ... not too bad
Horg solo Hunter Einherjar Lone Enforcer
Keriala solo rr6 Ranger
Eik solo rr6 Shadowblade
Ean solo rr4 Paladin

Re: Help for new Hunter

Cadebrennus wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 10:38 AM
inoeth wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 8:49 AM
4.0

That's what I thought but is it possible to get to the 1.5 speed cap using regular shot and a 4.0? The speed calculators I've used haven't shown this is possible (in reference to Pollojack's comment above)

No it’s not 1.5secs but it’s 2secs and doesn’t suffer from the dmg reduction with RF

Re: Help for new Hunter

gromet12 wrote:
Fri 14 Aug 2020 1:24 AM
Cadebrennus wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 10:38 AM
inoeth wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 8:49 AM
4.0

That's what I thought but is it possible to get to the 1.5 speed cap using regular shot and a 4.0? The speed calculators I've used haven't shown this is possible (in reference to Pollojack's comment above)

No it’s not 1.5secs but it’s 2secs and doesn’t suffer from the dmg reduction with RF

Weapon speed cap is 1.5
The Drunken Ranger!-keeping Devs honest since 2012
Also playing a dual-wielding Saracen
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsY42S8E3-bNo7koW7oFZug

The Drunken Ranger’s Guide to Drunken Rangery
https://forum.playphoenix.online/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=2902

Re: Help for new Hunter

Cadebrennus wrote:
Fri 14 Aug 2020 7:53 AM
gromet12 wrote:
Fri 14 Aug 2020 1:24 AM
Cadebrennus wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 10:38 AM
inoeth wrote:
Thu 13 Aug 2020 8:49 AM
4.0

That's what I thought but is it possible to get to the 1.5 speed cap using regular shot and a 4.0? The speed calculators I've used haven't shown this is possible (in reference to Pollojack's comment above)

No it’s not 1.5secs but it’s 2secs and doesn’t suffer from the dmg reduction with RF

Weapon speed cap is 1.5

And?