Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

A quick "back to topic" Suggestion:
To circumvent the problem regarding weapon swapping on other classes you could make it like this:

Revamp the envenom skilltree as suggested.
Only equipped weapons can be precoated with poison (3 weapons).
If you move a precoated weapon to your inventory, the poison vanishes.
You CAN still swap weapons for proc reasons, but it wouldnt make sense for poison purposes. This way no other classes are affected.

Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

byron wrote:
Mon 3 May 2021 10:55 AM
The problem of the /switch (and macros) for assassing is that it is quite easy for them to spam the target with any type of effects without any effort and without any downside, they need just to prepare their weapons before the fight and they are done. If a warrior swap to 2h from 1h+shield, he has more damage but less defence and slower swing rate. So in this case the player needs to evaluate what he needs in that moment. Assassins just spam you any effect to dead using different weapons without any negative side doing that (a part of the strong ego of some of them )

Yeaaah, switching between 1h+shield between swings doesn't give you the shield defense bonus right? Good tanks swing with their large weapon 100% of the time in solo, and they switch shield during the 2.5s in between. And they just have to click on the shield icon in their bar.
Without any downside, except watching the resists, having to pass the defenses of the adversary and investing hundreads of points in a spec and having the magic damage diminished by AoM EM and the skald/pally/etc. resists. This argument makes no sense. It's like saying "mercenary make more damages with their left hand with each point in dual for free and without effort, because it swing automatically".

If you want to speak about stupid OP brainless things, a zerk 10L put me at 45% life afk with RA 5...
He came back from AFK, and killed me in 3 swings.

Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

Noashakra wrote:
Mon 3 May 2021 5:08 PM
Yeaaah, switching between 1h+shield between swings doesn't give you the shield defense bonus right? Good tanks swing with their large weapon 100% of the time in solo, and they switch shield during the 2.5s in between. And they just have to click on the shield icon in their bar.
Without any downside, except watching the resists, having to pass the defenses of the adversary and investing hundreads of points in a spec and having the magic damage diminished by AoM EM and the skald/pally/etc. resists. This argument makes no sense. It's like saying "mercenary make more damages with their left hand with each point in dual for free and without effort, because it swing automatically".

If you want to speak about stupid OP brainless things, a zerk 10L put me at 45% life afk with RA 5...
He came back from AFK, and killed me in 3 swings.

Lets' take a warrior: the warrior has 3 slots : 1hand + shield + 2 hand. they are already equipped so if the player wants to swap the weapons from 1h to 2h on every swing good for him (but I hope here there isn't any macro that helps to do that, I consider this type of macro as a cheat but it is my personal opinion...). The assassins have 3-4 weapons in the inventory with dots/debuffs/effects already applied... I see a difference, don't you ?
Then, I found that a 10L zerk specced for solo with dual reflex 5 (a lot of points) can defeat an assassin, but for sure you had vanish down... and if you complain about reflex attack (that few players have both for the required points and for the play style), many can complain about Viper (that every assassin has).

Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

The problem here is AHK not the ability to swap weapons.

The ability to swap different weapons for different procs adds a lot of skill based play to melee classes on Phoenix. Removing this option would lower the fun on the server.

( I manually drag my weapons into inventory for poison swaps - i think it takes a tremendous amount of training = skill, to do it well at a high swing speed. - Same for the shield swap, you have to know your own cooldown, count in attack speed or d/q debuffs, if you do it manually. - the problem here is AHK.)

- While i see the benefit to allow AHK for older/disabled players, i think it is a huge problem for the competitive/esports/fair-play part of DaoC Phoenix. -
Xpovoc, Jukaron, Nephamael, Mauril, Lareya, Aideen, Njoro

Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

To summerize some suggestions here:

weaponswapping:
- add swingspeed of the weapon, you swap in, to your current attack delay (no matter if it comes from your inventory or from another active slot)

poisons:
- you can only apply poison to active weapons - moving them to the inventory will negate the poison effect on the weapon
- change the poison-tree to skills with delays and maximum-poison-applies depending on hardpoints

If I've missed something than please just quote and add, thank you.

Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

thalamar wrote:
Mon 3 May 2021 7:01 PM
To summerize some suggestions here:

weaponswapping:
- add swingspeed of the weapon, you swap in, to your current attack delay (no matter if it comes from your inventory or from another active slot)

poisons:
- you can only apply poison to active weapons - moving them to the inventory will negate the poison effect on the weapon
- change the poison-tree to skills with delays and maximum-poison-applies depending on hardpoints

If I've missed something than please just quote and add, thank you.

uth/schaf please dont do these terrible suggestions lmao
Itachi - Bard
Kurbsen - Champion

Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

byron wrote:
Mon 3 May 2021 5:45 PM
Then, I found that a 10L zerk specced for solo with dual reflex 5 (a lot of points) can defeat an assassin, but for sure you had vanish down... and if you complain about reflex attack (that few players have both for the required points and for the play style), many can complain about Viper (that every assassin has).

lmao, a lot of sins don't have it. I have it to 3 on my NS and 2 on my inf. I think exo don't have it at all.
Viper is not on the same level as RA. It's impossible to kill a solo light tank 1vs1 with RA if you are a melee(you would have to kite, but they all have snare styles, if they are good, you can't escape). You can't apply poison AFK, you can't kill 2 melee hitting you at the same time with poisons (you can kill 3 people with a merc with RA 5, you don't even have to fumble).

Assassins were thought with the weapon switch in their design. If you don't apply your poisons after purge you are dead. That's why they have one of the worst damage table of the game. They kill with poisons, you know, because they are assassins!

PS: if you play your hero with only 1 LW, you don't play your class well. Hero has LW with add damage 11.3 that you need to switch when it procs. You also need to play with a spear to rear snare. Bm/Merc can't hold a shield and a left hand, so they need to switch too. My BM has 3 weapons (debuff d/q, haste, LT) and 2 shields (add dmg and abla) I can go and and on and on.

Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

What I find a bit funny in general is most complaints are about Sins swapping. Which is ofc true, but that is not because of the envenom mechanic, simply because there is a /switch command, which let's you easily change your offhand to for extra poison while on live it was just Mainhand drag. 2 poisons vs 1 or on the 2 attackround it is 4 poisons vs 2. That is flawed/issue.

The other complain is about Fulltanks or Hybrids switching between shield and 2h for damage and defence. Being even called abuse by Grün.

Nowhere do I read any complaints about BM and Merc being able to switch between their offhand and shield because of the /switch command. This is actually true abuse because this was never possible and is a Phoenix only thing, making BM/Merc as main damage dealers also having an incredible high defence, which should not be possible but somehow every thinks that is fine just because "hey they are Lighttanks".
Yarna is not nice

Re: No swapping in weapons from your inventoy in a fight and poisons become instant-spells with a shared cooldown-timer

Saroi wrote:
Tue 4 May 2021 12:16 PM
What I find a bit funny in general is most complaints are about Sins swapping. Which is ofc true, but that is not because of the envenom mechanic, simply because there is a /switch command, which let's you easily change your offhand to for extra poison while on live it was just Mainhand drag. 2 poisons vs 1 or on the 2 attackround it is 4 poisons vs 2. That is flawed/issue.

The other complain is about Fulltanks or Hybrids switching between shield and 2h for damage and difference. Being even called abuse by Grün.

Nowhere do I read any complaints about BM and Merc being able to switch between their offhand and shield because of the /switch command. This is actually true abuse because this was never possible and is a Phoenix only thing, making BM/Merc as main damage dealers also having an incredible high defence, which should not be possible but somehow every thinks that is fine just because "hey they are Lighttanks".

Exactly...it's easier for me to switch to shield between hits on my solo BM than on my 1h/2h tanks. There I got to make one /switch macro on the others I switch between two mouse buttons. of course I could also just do a 2h slot only macro on my other tanks but I stated it out to mainly prove the point that calling 1h/2h abuse and letting lighttanks have a /switch between 1h/s and dw is a joke.
Tamy // Yarna