The Arena - FAQ & Feedback

This Monday, Marchst 1st, we'll run another Arena test with group cap 8. There will be 2 runs again:
EU prime time: 8pm cet to midnight cet
NA prime time: 8pm est to midnight est

Starting Event RR will be 7L0.

See here for more information on the event RR: https://forum.playphoenix.online/get-involved/planned-changes/28262-the-arena-faq-feedback?page=3#p155468

Changes from normal RvR:
- style snares that are not follow up styles will now have a 10 second duration + base weapon speed, values subject to change
- follow up style snares will now have a 13 second duration + 2x base weapon speed, values subject to change

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To participate you have to be in a full group and your group leader has to register at the arena npc. Those npcs can be found in the border keeps as well as in the safe zone of the arena.

It is possible that the short pre test will have a smaller group size to ensure the matchmaking can be tested properly.

Initial ruleset for the arena:
- No realm timer
- Groupsize: 8
- No cross realm groups
- PvP ruleset to allow fights between groups of the same realm
- Matches between groups are instanced and consist of multiple fights (best of 3)
- Cooldowns will be reset only before the first fight against a group, ie at the start of the best of 3
- In addition to the normal kill rp, each fight will also grant 1000 rp to every member of both groups, like gvg
- Groups currently registered in the arena will be listed in /gvg list

arena commands:
/arena queued: shows the arena queue
/arena info: shows arena instruction text
/arena ready: ready up in preparation phase, must be used by group leader
/arena unregister: unregister to avoid getting into new fights

how to - The Arena:
1. form a group of 8
2. the group leader clicks <register> on the registry npc either in your local border keep or in the arena safe zone
3. as soon as a group has been found to fight you, you will get ported to an instance
4. get ready for the fight, pets will spawn automatically on classes that can charm a pet
5. both group leaders have to do /arena ready
6. after a best of 3, both groups will be ported back to the safe zone
7a. if you want to fight again, just wait until the next fight starts
7b. if you want to stop, type /arena unregister and leave the zone via the teleporter
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Re: The Arena - FAQ & Feedback

Would you consider discussing a change for the Necro for (or during) this Event?

As of now, the Setup that includes a Necro is at a heavy disadvantage.
The Necro pet is, and will be, always Target Nr.1 for every enemy Grp which will grant 99% of the time a win for 2 specific Reasons.

1. The Necro is not picked into a setup because he is wearing fancy shoes, obviously the sole reason is to make him part of the strat (AF Debuff/unbreakable Snare). So he is key part/enabler to make the setup work. Without him, the setup simply wont work. Which is fine all in itself, but it becomes a problem with the other point.
Again, just wanted to point out: The necro is only in setups, where he and his utility are a crucial part of that specific setup. He is not there as an interchangeable DPS class.

2. The very moment the Necro dies, the fight is basically a 7v8 for the rest of the fight.
A Tank gets a PR, 2 or 3 Buffs and a Heal and is then good to go, any Caster the same. A Support has some work ahead of him, but he is back in action also right after.
After a Resurrection of the fallen Teammate, the Fight is back to 8v8.
But not with the Necro. The Necro is "not good to go" after a PR, some buffs and a Heal. Rezzing him does not turn the Fight into a 8v8 again, it remains 7v8.
In fact, it basically forces the Alb grp to "push" in a 6v8 (1 supp is dedicated to the Necro) to give the necro time to be rezzed and resummon his pet.

The "Pet summon" is basically the deciding factor here. Any form of interrupt will keep the necro out of the fight, Which is easy to do with the cast time of 20s.
He will never be able to get back into the fight. The payoff for the enemy grp to focus on a Necro is just to big here.
If his Grp can not defend his position, he is either interrupted, dead or forced to reposition all the time. Unlike any other class, he is basically of 0 benefit to the Grp/fight after a Resurrection.
Not even "worth" the time/resources a support has to invest in. It will remain a 7v8 even if he is resurrected. Might as well just leave him Dead. Every fight.
Its not a fight anymore that revolves around decisions, shot calling or positioning etc. Everytime it simply devolves into "killing the No-recovery Necro".
This outcome can be forced reliably by the enemy.

I dont really care that much about the necro, and i stopped playing a long while ago one once everybody jumped on the hype-train for the "broken" part of playing one, but if you want to make the necro part of a hybrid/tanker setup, this needs to be addressed somehow.
The problem is not his death. the problem is not his resurrection. the problem is that he can be effectively forced out of a fight easily. Punishing every Grp that includes a Necro into their setup. Its basically an auto-loss.

The change i would like to propose to you and/or the council of yours to consider testing for/in this event:
Put in every 3 spec lines "Deathsight", "Painworking" and "Death Servant" at LVL46 (or 47 or 48 or w/e) a new spell.
An uninterruptible 3sec Pet Summon with a 5min/10min/15min/whateverbalanceisabitch timer.
To offset this easily exploitable weakness a bit.

Re: The Arena - FAQ & Feedback

I don't disagree. Every loss of a team member is a detriment to a Grp.
But every class, besides a necro, has a viable recovery/comeback after a rezz. The necro simply doesn't.
I have no desire to strengthen the necro to gain anything from it. But there is an obvious gameplay flaw for a "8v8". The moment a 8v8 turns into a 7v8 by exploiting a weakness in class design.
Focusing down a crucial part of the enemy team has always a pay off (u might lose a member on the other side), but the gain by doing this "trade" for a necro is just to big. The payoff, the gain/loss is too big.

If the devs didn't try to put a necro in 8v8 hybrid/tanker setups, i wouldn't have bothered.
So if those setups fail in this event, i want to make sure it's addressed correctly, and not by upping something else.

That's why i merely asked them if they would consider discussing it.

Re: The Arena - FAQ & Feedback

i believe you are underestimating the effect of the whole group losing their speccbuffs
and still buffers don't always get focussed first, because always training the same target also has it's disadvantages.

If necros would actually always become the first target, any decent group could easily abuse that and use it against their opponents

Re: The Arena - FAQ & Feedback

Sepplord wrote:
Mon 18 Jan 2021 1:47 PM
i believe you are underestimating the effect of the whole group losing their speccbuffs
and still buffers don't always get focussed first, because always training the same target also has it's disadvantages.
Really, i don't.

I do respect your opinion and also agree that there are different levels, based on the class, a "loss" a Team member can have and that a "loss" of a supporting role is far above of that of a necro.
That's not what my point is about.

Honestly, i really am not here to argue about that or defend anything i said or question anything you say.
I have no desire to change anyone's opinion. I've said my piece.

Re: The Arena - FAQ & Feedback

Changes between the pre test and later today:
- you can no longer unregister while in a match
- after a match you will have at least 30 seconds in the safe zone before the next match against another group can start
- fixed an issue that caused getting matched against the same group back to back
- region chat is now enabled

Re: The Arena - FAQ & Feedback

This event is good but it could do with a slight change.
Is there a way to make it so you port into a random location, and you have to roam a little to find the enemy, rather than straight infront of the opposing teams?. Tank groups stand no chance in this event as all the groups you face just pre kite and can also use the discord bot to find out who they're against prior.
Tank groups do so much better in a normal roaming "inc" rather than a head on fight