Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

inoeth wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:44 PM
evert wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:40 PM
I mean the disease part is nice but I already have FA2 so I'm not getting FA2, I'm getting moparry 3->6 or whatever and in exchange everyone else gets FA2! Bad deal if you ask me.

well and who can use it in a fight? right nobody but skalds/minstrels ....
from that perspective 9 extra points for moparry is huge!

At least on skald a big proportion of the times I use FA the opponent could use it too if they had it (snare+kite+FA or sos+FA). So it will just reset the fight entirely rather then being a tool for me

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

evert wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:40 PM
I mean the disease part is nice but I already have FA2 so I'm not getting FA2, I'm getting moparry 3->6 or whatever and in exchange everyone else gets FA2! Bad deal if you ask me.

Well your reasoning is pretty flawed. Everyone can already get fa, and skald minst aren't the only classes that hold the ability to cc then run off and first aid. Also this game isn't balanced around what is good for your solo skald. (Even though this is way better for your skald and you somehow don't see it)

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

inoeth wrote:
evert wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:40 PM
I mean the disease part is nice but I already have FA2 so I'm not getting FA2, I'm getting moparry 3->6 or whatever and in exchange everyone else gets FA2! Bad deal if you ask me.

well and who can use it in a fight? right nobody but skalds/minstrels ....
from that perspective 9 extra points for moparry is huge!
Everyone can use it after having a close duel with Infil/SB/NS that you´ve won, to not die by the poisons of it

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

gruenesschaf wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:12 PM
This change will go live on Monday together with the initial round of the keep fight changes.

Tireless 1 will become baseline to everyone at level 5 and will no longer be an RA. Tireless 1 remains the highest attainable level.
Long wind 1 will become baseline to everyone at level 10 and will no longer be an RA. Long wind 1 remains the highest attainable level.
First Aid 2 will become baseline to everyone at level 24 and no longer be an RA. First aid 2 will be the highest attainable level. In addition to that first aid will cure diseases, however this cure will happen AFTER the heal meaning the heal component will be affected by disease.

A free realm respec will be provided to all characters.

Reasoning:
Tireless and long wind are must picks by pretty much everyone making it quite annoying if your forget to pick it up after a respec, other than that nothing is really gained by having these forced picks for 2 points.
First aid in its current form is almost entirely unused as it's not really considered to be worth the points by most. Making it baseline is a qol and adding the cure disease component resolves another loud issue without changing diseases themselves.

The main usage of first aid should be small man / solos after an engagement or in prolonged sieges, if it turns out to have a negative impact on actual combat an additional 5 - 20 second timer might be added to the current out of combat requirement.

Tireless + LW --> good

free buffed FA II for anyone is bad. just bad. the impact is bigger than you might think. for a lot of classes kiting is just part of their natural tactics.
if you now must kite knowing that EVERYONE has a free 60% heal + disease remove after 10s out of combat, changes a lot. and of course, it's instant and thus usuable while running. so you can't kite for more than 10s anymore without putting your enemy in combat (remember the custom changes here: bleeds and dots don't keep you in combat).
also it changes fights in which you hunt them down fast because you know they need to rest up. for stealths this is big too. as soon as they can stealth (= out of combat), they get a 60% heal and disease remove every 3min. so they are (almost) fully back on track very fast after a fight. do we really want that and call it QoL?

why change a existing RA and not introduce the solution to the problem you want to solve: a free disease self remove with a 4s castime, usuable out of combat...

btw. it's hardly a nerf to those who specced it right now. this change frees up 11 points for them (more than a whole realm rank!!) and on top removes disease now.

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

Ibs wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:48 PM
evert wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:40 PM
I mean the disease part is nice but I already have FA2 so I'm not getting FA2, I'm getting moparry 3->6 or whatever and in exchange everyone else gets FA2! Bad deal if you ask me.

Well your reasoning is pretty flawed. Everyone can already get fa, and skald minst aren't the only classes that hold the ability to cc then run off and first aid. Also this game isn't balanced around what is good for your solo skald. (Even though this is way better for your skald and you somehow don't see it)

I can't help if people are stupid and don't spec FA! But now they will have it and *maybe* use it.

And obviously the game isn't balanced around that, I'm just whining.

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

evert wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:46 PM
inoeth wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:44 PM
evert wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:40 PM
I mean the disease part is nice but I already have FA2 so I'm not getting FA2, I'm getting moparry 3->6 or whatever and in exchange everyone else gets FA2! Bad deal if you ask me.

well and who can use it in a fight? right nobody but skalds/minstrels ....
from that perspective 9 extra points for moparry is huge!

At least on skald a big proportion of the times I use FA the opponent could use it too if they had it (snare+kite+FA or sos+FA). So it will just reset the fight entirely rather then being a tool for me

"could" yes if that would be anything close to reality... in fact "in-combat-mezz" classes (hint: skald/minstrel) are the only ones who can use it effectivly in every fight and both classes are already pretty strong
Horg solo Hunter Einherjar Lone Enforcer ~42,8% solo kills
Eik solo Shadowblade Flammen Fru ~50% solo kills

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

Ibs wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:48 PM
evert wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:40 PM
I mean the disease part is nice but I already have FA2 so I'm not getting FA2, I'm getting moparry 3->6 or whatever and in exchange everyone else gets FA2! Bad deal if you ask me.

Well your reasoning is pretty flawed. Everyone can already get fa, and skald minst aren't the only classes that hold the ability to cc then run off and first aid. Also this game isn't balanced around what is good for your solo skald. (Even though this is way better for your skald and you somehow don't see it)
Stealthers can spec First Aid but never did it cause it cost too many points but now they got it for free

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

Skald and minstrels ("Battle-bard"?) can Reset the Fight with a Mezz.
Which means they can activate FA2 while the opponent can't, as the Skald/minstrel can and will reinitiate the Fight right after.
As far as i can see it, it's a free FA2 for these classes which used this type of strategy anyway.

The only way to do this is also with a Mezz, No Stun/snare/root will work the one-sided way, to make use of FA2, like a Mezz does.

It's a buff for everyone. Especially to all Stealther/Solo Players.

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

DJ2000 wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:58 PM
Skald and minstrels ("Battle-bard"?) can Reset the Fight with a Mezz.
Which means they can activate FA2 while the opponent can't, as the Skald/minstrel can and will reinitiate the Fight right after.
As far as i can see it, it's a free FA2 for these classes which used this type of strategy anyway.

The only way to do this is also with a Mezz, No Stun/snare/root will work the one-sided way, to make use of FA2, like a Mezz does.

It's a buff for everyone. Especially to all Stealther/Solo Players.
why no stun? If a Warrior slams you(9sec), he gotta stay 1sec out of combat and can use FA2

Re: First Aid, Tireless and Long Wind will become baseline

Faan wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 3:01 PM
DJ2000 wrote:
Wed 23 Sep 2020 2:58 PM
Skald and minstrels ("Battle-bard"?) can Reset the Fight with a Mezz.
Which means they can activate FA2 while the opponent can't, as the Skald/minstrel can and will reinitiate the Fight right after.
As far as i can see it, it's a free FA2 for these classes which used this type of strategy anyway.

The only way to do this is also with a Mezz, No Stun/snare/root will work the one-sided way, to make use of FA2, like a Mezz does.

It's a buff for everyone. Especially to all Stealther/Solo Players.
why no stun? If a Warrior slams you(9sec), he gotta stay 1sec out of combat and can use FA2

not if you spam dd charge
anyway using FA or preventing it will become the new meta and everyone who does not have a stun or any kind of cc is basicly fked
Horg solo Hunter Einherjar Lone Enforcer ~42,8% solo kills
Eik solo Shadowblade Flammen Fru ~50% solo kills